Subject: Digest for the period 11/17/2003 - 11/18/2003 Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2003 01:01:19 -0500 Table of contents ---------------------------------------------------------------------- 1. glass or plastic (Bob Paolino) 2. pencils (was: RE: And glass it is) (Bob Paolino) 3. Organizer List (Mike Dixon) 4. Competition supplies (hollen`at`woodsprite.com) 5. Re: Digest for the period 11/14/2003 - 11/15/2003 (allan.boyce`at`usbank.com) 6. RE: other Judging items (Webb, Mike) 7. Competition essentials (Jeff & Ellen) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Bob Paolino Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 07:14:05 Subject: glass or plastic I wrote: >those sampler glasses they have :-) Yes, I have judged with glass, and >not just at brewpubs--one competition I once travelled to was not at a >brewpub, but had a supply of fairly generic/cheap wine glasses. Each >judge had a few glasses (not one for every beer) and we just had to >rinse our own, not a big problem. ...and then, Mike Bennett wrote: >Yes, I have. Here in Oregon, just about every competition uses plastic >cups. However the Oregon State Fair uses white wine glasses and I have to BINGO! You read my mind (or something like that). The competition I mentioned was indeed the Oregon State Fair competition, that particular year in a beverage distributor's warehouse. I was beginning a trip to Vancouver (BC, that is, not across the river in WA) in Portland. I happened to have ZYMURGY with me on the plane and noticed the competition announcement, so called the organiser and offered to judge the next day. This is going to date me as far as judging goes, but I met Doug Henderson at the competition, and he invited me to stop at this new brewery, Hair of the Dog, :-) when I got back to Portland. Batch 4 was in the fermenter and I was given an unlabelled bottle of Batch 1 to take home. Foolish me, I shared it at a homebrew club meeting a few weeks later rather than letting it age and get even better. ...and Spencer Thomas wrote: >detergent residue can kill the head or add aromas, and glasses are >typically smoother than plastic and don't generate as much head. I'd say just about the opposite, assuming that the glass is beer clean. Do your local publicans serve beer (presumably in glass) that doesn't have a head? I've seen a lot more head retention problems with plastic than with glass. Oh, wait, I know! It's that all you Ann Arbour folks make and drink mead instead of beer. THAT'S why there's no head :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) (Okay, all mead except for the pre-Pro Pilseners. ;-) ) Now go have a beer, Bob Paolino >From the Department of Military Intelligence and Jumbo Shrimp: Sign seen on a recently poisoned lawn on Johnson: TruGreen/ChemLawn ( ) ASCII ribbon campaign X against HTML e-mail: / \ Friends don't send friends HTML-bloated messages! ********************************************************************** * JudgeNet - the beer judge digest * * Send plain text only, no HTML, MIME, encoded text or attachments * * Send subscription requests & changes to judge-request`at`synchro.com * ********************************************************************** ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Bob Paolino Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 07:39:07 Subject: pencils (was: RE: And glass it is) > Thanks to everyone who replied to my Glass Vs Plastic question. If I can >talk my Homebrew club (FOSSILS) into it, I will have glass tasting glasses at >our next competition. The suggestions on making sure the glasses are clean >were a big help too. If you're having the competition at a brewpub, they probably already have sampler glasses. New Albanian? Surely Roger could support the idea of proper glassware for tasting. > Okay, now my next questions - Create a list of items that the organizer of >a beer judging could provide for the judges, beyond the usual (water, glass >tasting glasses, bread, score sheets, flight sheet, etc, etc). Should there be lunch? >a calculator and flavor wheel for each group of judges? Are white table cloths I've never seen a flavour wheel provided for judges unless it was printed on the plastic cup, but, sure, why not? >just a waist of time? Good old number 2 pencil Vs mechanical pencil? I'm the smell of wood pencils might distract. Now go have a beer, Bob Paolino >From the Department of Military Intelligence and Jumbo Shrimp: Sign seen on a recently poisoned lawn on Johnson: TruGreen/ChemLawn ( ) ASCII ribbon campaign X against HTML e-mail: / \ Friends don't send friends HTML-bloated messages! ********************************************************************** * JudgeNet - the beer judge digest * * Send plain text only, no HTML, MIME, encoded text or attachments * * Send subscription requests & changes to judge-request`at`synchro.com * ********************************************************************** ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Mike Dixon Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 08:47:18 -0500 Subject: Organizer List > From: Ed Tash > Okay, now my next questions - Create a list of items that the organizer of > a beer judging could provide for the judges, beyond the usual (water, glass > tasting glasses, bread, score sheets, flight sheet, etc, etc). Bottle openers unless the steward is performing that task, and flashlights... >Should there be > a calculator and flavor wheel for each group of judges? A calculator could be useful to tabulate scores. >Are white table cloths > just a waist of time? Yes..IMO...it is better to provide flashlights and a well lit, comfortable venue. >Good old number 2 pencil Vs mechanical pencil? A mechanical pencil is better. You don't end up having to judge past the aroma of the #2 wood and lead shavings. Cheers, Mike Dixon Wake Forest, NC ********************************************************************** * JudgeNet - the beer judge digest * * Send plain text only, no HTML, MIME, encoded text or attachments * * Send subscription requests & changes to judge-request`at`synchro.com * ********************************************************************** ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: hollen`at`woodsprite.com Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 09:17:46 -0500 (EST) Subject: Competition supplies Never use regular #2 pencils. Causes too many comments on score sheets like - "smells faintly of cedar, inappropriate in style.". Mechanical pencils are the way to go. Also, and more important than mechanical pencils, since you can set a pencil down, unscented soap in the bathrooms. I don't know how many times I have taken a bathroom break and come back only to smell nothing but perfume from the hand soap. Judge's memory sheets. A line for every beer where you transfer scores and brief comments from score sheet so that later on , you can refer to previous beers while still being able to pass score sheets on to the organizational staff. dion -- Dion Hollenbeck Email: hollen`at`woodsprite.com Home Page: http://www.woodsprite.com Brewing Page: http://hbd.org/hollen ********************************************************************** * JudgeNet - the beer judge digest * * Send plain text only, no HTML, MIME, encoded text or attachments * * Send subscription requests & changes to judge-request`at`synchro.com * ********************************************************************** ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: allan.boyce`at`usbank.com Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 10:19:04 -0600 Subject: Re: Digest for the period 11/14/2003 - 11/15/2003 Dave- You've probably already been emailed by someone, but all of the BJCP forms are on their website. The one you're looking for is at: http://www.bjcp.org/scoresheet.pdf - Al ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Rice, David Date: Fri, 14 Nov 2003 16:32:26 -0500 Subject: Competition Evaluation Form in PDF format Anyone have the standard Competition Evaluation Form in PDF or Word format? Would appreciate an e-mail note from you if you have one or know where one can be found. Thanks to all. - David Rice, Cincinnati Malt Infusers david_rice`at`cinfin.com ********************************************************************** * JudgeNet - the beer judge digest * * Send plain text only, no HTML, MIME, encoded text or attachments * * Send subscription requests & changes to judge-request`at`synchro.com * ********************************************************************** ********************************************************************** * JudgeNet - the beer judge digest * * Send plain text only, no HTML, MIME, encoded text or attachments * * Send subscription requests & changes to judge-request`at`synchro.com * ********************************************************************** ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Webb, Mike Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 11:30:20 -0800 Subject: RE: other Judging items Okay, now my next questions - Create a list of items that the organizer of a beer judging could provide for the judges, beyond the usual (water, glass tasting glasses, bread, score sheets, flight sheet, etc, etc). I'd like to suggest providing mechanical pencils. I've had trouble with 'woody' smelling beers in the past from using regular pencils, plus they're a pain keeping sharp. Mike Webb ********************************************************************** * JudgeNet - the beer judge digest * * Send plain text only, no HTML, MIME, encoded text or attachments * * Send subscription requests & changes to judge-request`at`synchro.com * ********************************************************************** ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jeff & Ellen Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 18:33:14 -0500 Subject: Competition essentials Ed Task asked what makes good judging accessories. Don't forget bottle openers. It's amazing to me that sometimes a judge has to scrounge around for a bottle opener to start a flight. A cork screw is handy, too, for the occasional lambic, mead or old ale entered with a cork. Plenty of light in the judging room is a must. If not, get some small flashlights. Lots of competitions lately have been providing grease pencils to mark the plastic cups with the entry number. I've always used a sharpie for this, but there is an odor from a sharpie that can be objectionable. I'm pretty sure the grease pencils will work on glass and that the mark will not be too hard to remove when cleaning. If you plan to judge meads and ciders, be sure to print up some mead and cider score sheets. I like mechanical pencils, but make sure you buy the ones with erasers. I learned this one the hard way. A roll of paper towels should always be handy. Some sort of dump bucket should be at each table. Did I miss anything? Jeff Gladish, Tampa ********************************************************************** * JudgeNet - the beer judge digest * * Send plain text only, no HTML, MIME, encoded text or attachments * * Send subscription requests & changes to judge-request`at`synchro.com * ********************************************************************** Subject: Digest for the period 11/17/2003 - 11/18/2003 Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2003 01:01:19 -0500 Table of contents ---------------------------------------------------------------------- 1. glass or plastic (Bob Paolino) 2. pencils (was: RE: And glass it is) (Bob Paolino) 3. Organizer List (Mike Dixon) 4. Competition supplies (hollen`at`woodsprite.com) 5. Re: Digest for the period 11/14/2003 - 11/15/2003 (allan.boyce`at`usbank.com) 6. RE: other Judging items (Webb, Mike) 7. Competition essentials (Jeff & Ellen) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Bob Paolino Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 07:14:05 Subject: glass or plastic I wrote: >those sampler glasses they have :-) Yes, I have judged with glass, and >not just at brewpubs--one competition I once travelled to was not at a >brewpub, but had a supply of fairly generic/cheap wine glasses. Each >judge had a few glasses (not one for every beer) and we just had to >rinse our own, not a big problem. ...and then, Mike Bennett wrote: >Yes, I have. Here in Oregon, just about every competition uses plastic >cups. However the Oregon State Fair uses white wine glasses and I have to BINGO! You read my mind (or something like that). The competition I mentioned was indeed the Oregon State Fair competition, that particular year in a beverage distributor's warehouse. I was beginning a trip to Vancouver (BC, that is, not across the river in WA) in Portland. I happened to have ZYMURGY with me on the plane and noticed the competition announcement, so called the organiser and offered to judge the next day. This is going to date me as far as judging goes, but I met Doug Henderson at the competition, and he invited me to stop at this new brewery, Hair of the Dog, :-) when I got back to Portland. Batch 4 was in the fermenter and I was given an unlabelled bottle of Batch 1 to take home. Foolish me, I shared it at a homebrew club meeting a few weeks later rather than letting it age and get even better. ...and Spencer Thomas wrote: >detergent residue can kill the head or add aromas, and glasses are >typically smoother than plastic and don't generate as much head. I'd say just about the opposite, assuming that the glass is beer clean. Do your local publicans serve beer (presumably in glass) that doesn't have a head? I've seen a lot more head retention problems with plastic than with glass. Oh, wait, I know! It's that all you Ann Arbour folks make and drink mead instead of beer. THAT'S why there's no head :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) (Okay, all mead except for the pre-Pro Pilseners. ;-) ) Now go have a beer, Bob Paolino >From the Department of Military Intelligence and Jumbo Shrimp: Sign seen on a recently poisoned lawn on Johnson: TruGreen/ChemLawn ( ) ASCII ribbon campaign X against HTML e-mail: / \ Friends don't send friends HTML-bloated messages! ********************************************************************** * JudgeNet - the beer judge digest * * Send plain text only, no HTML, MIME, encoded text or attachments * * Send subscription requests & changes to judge-request`at`synchro.com * ********************************************************************** ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Bob Paolino Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 07:39:07 Subject: pencils (was: RE: And glass it is) > Thanks to everyone who replied to my Glass Vs Plastic question. If I can >talk my Homebrew club (FOSSILS) into it, I will have glass tasting glasses at >our next competition. The suggestions on making sure the glasses are clean >were a big help too. If you're having the competition at a brewpub, they probably already have sampler glasses. New Albanian? Surely Roger could support the idea of proper glassware for tasting. > Okay, now my next questions - Create a list of items that the organizer of >a beer judging could provide for the judges, beyond the usual (water, glass >tasting glasses, bread, score sheets, flight sheet, etc, etc). Should there be lunch? >a calculator and flavor wheel for each group of judges? Are white table cloths I've never seen a flavour wheel provided for judges unless it was printed on the plastic cup, but, sure, why not? >just a waist of time? Good old number 2 pencil Vs mechanical pencil? I'm the smell of wood pencils might distract. Now go have a beer, Bob Paolino >From the Department of Military Intelligence and Jumbo Shrimp: Sign seen on a recently poisoned lawn on Johnson: TruGreen/ChemLawn ( ) ASCII ribbon campaign X against HTML e-mail: / \ Friends don't send friends HTML-bloated messages! ********************************************************************** * JudgeNet - the beer judge digest * * Send plain text only, no HTML, MIME, encoded text or attachments * * Send subscription requests & changes to judge-request`at`synchro.com * ********************************************************************** ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Mike Dixon Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 08:47:18 -0500 Subject: Organizer List > From: Ed Tash > Okay, now my next questions - Create a list of items that the organizer of > a beer judging could provide for the judges, beyond the usual (water, glass > tasting glasses, bread, score sheets, flight sheet, etc, etc). Bottle openers unless the steward is performing that task, and flashlights... >Should there be > a calculator and flavor wheel for each group of judges? A calculator could be useful to tabulate scores. >Are white table cloths > just a waist of time? Yes..IMO...it is better to provide flashlights and a well lit, comfortable venue. >Good old number 2 pencil Vs mechanical pencil? A mechanical pencil is better. You don't end up having to judge past the aroma of the #2 wood and lead shavings. Cheers, Mike Dixon Wake Forest, NC ********************************************************************** * JudgeNet - the beer judge digest * * Send plain text only, no HTML, MIME, encoded text or attachments * * Send subscription requests & changes to judge-request`at`synchro.com * ********************************************************************** ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: hollen`at`woodsprite.com Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 09:17:46 -0500 (EST) Subject: Competition supplies Never use regular #2 pencils. Causes too many comments on score sheets like - "smells faintly of cedar, inappropriate in style.". Mechanical pencils are the way to go. Also, and more important than mechanical pencils, since you can set a pencil down, unscented soap in the bathrooms. I don't know how many times I have taken a bathroom break and come back only to smell nothing but perfume from the hand soap. Judge's memory sheets. A line for every beer where you transfer scores and brief comments from score sheet so that later on , you can refer to previous beers while still being able to pass score sheets on to the organizational staff. dion -- Dion Hollenbeck Email: hollen`at`woodsprite.com Home Page: http://www.woodsprite.com Brewing Page: http://hbd.org/hollen ********************************************************************** * JudgeNet - the beer judge digest * * Send plain text only, no HTML, MIME, encoded text or attachments * * Send subscription requests & changes to judge-request`at`synchro.com * ********************************************************************** ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: allan.boyce`at`usbank.com Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 10:19:04 -0600 Subject: Re: Digest for the period 11/14/2003 - 11/15/2003 Dave- You've probably already been emailed by someone, but all of the BJCP forms are on their website. The one you're looking for is at: http://www.bjcp.org/scoresheet.pdf - Al ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Rice, David Date: Fri, 14 Nov 2003 16:32:26 -0500 Subject: Competition Evaluation Form in PDF format Anyone have the standard Competition Evaluation Form in PDF or Word format? Would appreciate an e-mail note from you if you have one or know where one can be found. Thanks to all. - David Rice, Cincinnati Malt Infusers david_rice`at`cinfin.com ********************************************************************** * JudgeNet - the beer judge digest * * Send plain text only, no HTML, MIME, encoded text or attachments * * Send subscription requests & changes to judge-request`at`synchro.com * ********************************************************************** ********************************************************************** * JudgeNet - the beer judge digest * * Send plain text only, no HTML, MIME, encoded text or attachments * * Send subscription requests & changes to judge-request`at`synchro.com * ********************************************************************** ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Webb, Mike Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 11:30:20 -0800 Subject: RE: other Judging items Okay, now my next questions - Create a list of items that the organizer of a beer judging could provide for the judges, beyond the usual (water, glass tasting glasses, bread, score sheets, flight sheet, etc, etc). I'd like to suggest providing mechanical pencils. I've had trouble with 'woody' smelling beers in the past from using regular pencils, plus they're a pain keeping sharp. Mike Webb ********************************************************************** * JudgeNet - the beer judge digest * * Send plain text only, no HTML, MIME, encoded text or attachments * * Send subscription requests & changes to judge-request`at`synchro.com * ********************************************************************** ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jeff & Ellen Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 18:33:14 -0500 Subject: Competition essentials Ed Task asked what makes good judging accessories. Don't forget bottle openers. It's amazing to me that sometimes a judge has to scrounge around for a bottle opener to start a flight. A cork screw is handy, too, for the occasional lambic, mead or old ale entered with a cork. Plenty of light in the judging room is a must. If not, get some small flashlights. Lots of competitions lately have been providing grease pencils to mark the plastic cups with the entry number. I've always used a sharpie for this, but there is an odor from a sharpie that can be objectionable. I'm pretty sure the grease pencils will work on glass and that the mark will not be too hard to remove when cleaning. If you plan to judge meads and ciders, be sure to print up some mead and cider score sheets. I like mechanical pencils, but make sure you buy the ones with erasers. I learned this one the hard way. A roll of paper towels should always be handy. Some sort of dump bucket should be at each table. Did I miss anything? Jeff Gladish, Tampa ********************************************************************** * JudgeNet - the beer judge digest * * Send plain text only, no HTML, MIME, encoded text or attachments * * Send subscription requests & changes to judge-request`at`synchro.com * **********************************************************************