Subject: Digest for the period 1/11/02 - 1/12/02 Date: Sat, 12 Jan 2002 01:04:29 -0500 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Next_Part_SYNC4433419E13" --Next_Part_SYNC4433419E13 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Table of contents ---------------------------------------------------------------------- West Coast Stouts (Randy Paul) RE: Digest for the period 1/10/02 - 1/11/02 (Paul Gatza) AHA Promotion of BJCP Competitions (Paul Gatza) Double posting (Bill Wible) Reassurance (Steve Casselman) --Next_Part_SYNC4433419E13 Content-Type: multipart/digest; boundary="Message_Part_SYNC4433419E13" --Message_Part_SYNC4433419E13 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Return-Path: Received: from ren-1.cais.net ([205.252.14.76]) by synchro.com with SMTP (Mailtraq/1.1.6.1176) id SYNC44094194FA for judge`at`synchro.com; Fri, 11 Jan 2002 01:39:02 -0500 Received: from [207.226.56.5] (ppp49.net-A.cais.net [205.252.61.49]) by ren-1.cais.net (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g0B6ctf13813 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2002 01:38:55 -0500 (EST) X-Sender: randy`at`shell.cais.com Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 01:39:32 -0500 To: JudgeNet - the beer judge digest From: Randy Paul Reply-To: "JudgeNet - the beer judge digest" Errors-To: judge-owner`at`synchro.com Sender: judge`at`synchro.com Subject: West Coast Stouts X-Hops: 3 X-POST-MessageClass: 10; Mailing List Message I'm curious why there is no category for West Coast Stouts? How have these entries been faring as specialty/experimental (quite different competing styles), as Porters (wrong roasted malt character), or as Stouts (wrong hops)? -- Randy --Message_Part_SYNC4433419E13 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Return-Path: Received: from mailman.aob.org ([206.168.226.8]) by synchro.com with SMTP (Mailtraq/1.1.6.1176) id SYNC44194199FB for judge`at`synchro.com; Fri, 11 Jan 2002 11:35:12 -0500 Received: from aob21 (unassigned.aob.org [206.168.226.14] (may be forged)) by mailman.aob.org (Build 98 8.9.3/NT-8.9.3) with SMTP id JAA04926 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2002 09:35:19 -0700 From: "Paul Gatza" Reply-To: "JudgeNet - the beer judge digest" Errors-To: judge-owner`at`synchro.com Sender: judge`at`synchro.com To: JudgeNet - the beer judge digest Subject: RE: Digest for the period 1/10/02 - 1/11/02 Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 09:35:19 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: X-Hops: 3 X-POST-MessageClass: 10; Mailing List Message Bill W. asked "Are you going to tell us that St .Pat's is the sole wholesale distributor of malt mills?" Bill, it appears that your grudge with St. Patrick's runs deep and I'm sure that you have good reasons for that, such as business that you perceived was yours may now be St. Patrick's. I believe that the homebrewing community improves when people are supporting their local shop, and that it is up to the local shop to show customers that they carry the products they desire at competitive prices. A primary message whenever Gary or Charlie or I address homebrewers is to point out the local shopkeepers in the crowd and remind homebrewers of their contribution to the community and the need to support the shop or it may not be there in the future. AHA is not in the business of policing the homebrew supply industry. We are in the business of supporting the educational and community-building aspects of homebrewing. The point of the publication was to get some basic brewing informational support in the hands of homebrewers. I set a policy for the advertising staff to follow. I think the policy is sound. We have to go by what we know about potential advertisers, due to the four-digit number of businesses we contact about different advertising and sponsorship opportunities. Other than businesses that have burned us with bad debt, we do not limit potential advertisers with the exception of this project (in order to ensure the free distribution). We have no policy for ads that may be of a questionable or offensive nature, but we would deal with the matter on a case-by-case basis if something did come up. Regarding the ad for the malt mill on page 17 of Zymurgy for Beginners, I do not know if that ad was placed by the manufacturer or St. Patrick's. It is common for a manufacturer to use the contact information of the distributor. I know the malt extract companies normally place their wholesalers info in the ad. Julia Herz, who sold the ad space in the publication, is with Redstone Meadery. I will ask her if she recalls the specifics of this ad the next time I see her. I will email you if I learn anything more. >In fact, it gives me the impression that you admit nothing, and that more of the same is on the way.> Our supply of 15,000 copies will likely run out in 2003. As I mentioned before, I may have been wrong about whether St. Patrick's qualified for inclusion in Zymurgy for Beginners at the time we were selling the ad space, based on my understanding of their business at that time. When the time comes to resell advertising space, I will contact Lynne O'Connor at St. Patrick's to address whether the business qualifies under the criteria. --Message_Part_SYNC4433419E13 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Return-Path: Received: from mailman.aob.org ([206.168.226.8]) by synchro.com with SMTP (Mailtraq/1.1.6.1176) id SYNC4419419A11 for judge`at`synchro.com; Fri, 11 Jan 2002 11:50:17 -0500 Received: from aob21 (unassigned.aob.org [206.168.226.14] (may be forged)) by mailman.aob.org (Build 98 8.9.3/NT-8.9.3) with SMTP id JAA04946 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2002 09:50:25 -0700 From: "Paul Gatza" Reply-To: "JudgeNet - the beer judge digest" Errors-To: judge-owner`at`synchro.com Sender: judge`at`synchro.com To: JudgeNet - the beer judge digest Subject: AHA Promotion of BJCP Competitions Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 09:50:25 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal X-Hops: 3 X-POST-MessageClass: 10; Mailing List Message Hi everyone. I would like people to know of a couple of minor changes in how AHA will be promoting BJCP competitions. In the past we took a passive approach to promoting BJCP competitions; that is, if a competition organizer asked us to list the BJCP-sanctioned event we would. AHA Administrator Kate Porter now is adding every BJCP-sanctioned competition to the Zymurgy and beertown calendars. Kate's Zymurgy deadline is 50 days before the month listed on the cover. So if you wish to get a competition listed in the May/June Zymurgy, it would need to appear on the BJCP calendar by March 10th. Kate can be emailed directly at mailto:kate`at`aob.org. AHA Project Coordinator Gary Glass has submitted a web change that will include a link to the BJCP site on the beertown calendar and sanctioned competition section of beertown. Paul Gatza Director--American Homebrewers Association Director--Institute for Brewing Studies Association of Brewers 736 Pearl St., Boulder, CO, USA 80302 +1.303.447.0816 ext. 122 mailto:paul`at`aob.org www.beertown.org --Message_Part_SYNC4433419E13 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Return-Path: Received: from diskless7.axs2000.net ([209.120.196.45]) by synchro.com with SMTP (Mailtraq/1.1.6.1176) id SYNC4421419AD1 for judge`at`synchro.com; Fri, 11 Jan 2002 13:24:04 -0500 Received: from [64.80.87.220] (ppp-087-220.verio.axs2000.net [64.80.87.220]) by diskless7.axs2000.net (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id g0BINff12256 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2002 13:23:41 -0500 User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 13:23:57 -0500 Subject: Double posting From: Bill Wible Reply-To: "JudgeNet - the beer judge digest" Errors-To: judge-owner`at`synchro.com Sender: judge`at`synchro.com To: JudgeNet - the beer judge digest Message-ID: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Hops: 3 X-POST-MessageClass: 10; Mailing List Message Everyone, I do not know why the most recent post I sent showed up in both of the last 2 digests. It was nothing I did - I only posted it once yesterday. I was surprised to see it show up a second time. I guess it was a computer thing. My apologies for this continuing negative thread and the double post, even though it was not intended. I will post no further on this, as I've said all I need to. I do agree with David Houseman and the others that we should move on to more positive things. Bill --Message_Part_SYNC4433419E13 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Return-Path: Received: from mta7.pltn13.pbi.net ([64.164.98.8]) by synchro.com with SMTP (Mailtraq/1.1.6.1176) id SYNC4423419B5A for judge`at`synchro.com; Fri, 11 Jan 2002 15:29:52 -0500 Received: from mail2.vcc.com ([64.174.106.246]) by mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 (built May 7 2001)) with ESMTP id <0GPS00EGUJLOP3`at`mta7.pltn13.pbi.net> for judge at synchro.com; Fri, 11 Jan 2002 12:29:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from HILBERT (hilbert [192.168.0.153]) by mail2.vcc.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 67633373F2 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2002 12:30:23 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 12:25:16 -0800 From: Steve Casselman Reply-To: "JudgeNet - the beer judge digest" Errors-To: judge-owner`at`synchro.com Sender: judge`at`synchro.com Subject: Reassurance In-reply-to: To: JudgeNet - the beer judge digest Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal X-Hops: 3 X-POST-MessageClass: 10; Mailing List Message This will not happen again. You have to remember who is on the board of advisors. We have Pat Babcock, Louis Bonham, Mark Tumarkin, Dave Houseman along with others who don't take orders form the AHA/AOB. And we will be looking over Paul shoulder to make sure this does not happen again. You can say what ever you want about past AHA/AOB actions but you can't tell me that you distrust all the board members. So I give you my word that if anything even looks like it is not absolutely fair on this kind of point for all I will make it a point to let everyone know what is going on. I can't change the past but I (along with the rest of the board) can make sure it does not happen again. Steve Casselman --------- Bill said And your IF statement with a built in assumption does nothing to reassure me or any of the other stores who were denied advertising in this publication that it won't happen again. In fact, it gives me the impression that you admit nothing, and that more of the same --Message_Part_SYNC4433419E13-- --Next_Part_SYNC4433419E13-- Subject: Digest for the period 1/11/02 - 1/12/02 Date: Sat, 12 Jan 2002 01:04:29 -0500 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Next_Part_SYNC4433419E13" --Next_Part_SYNC4433419E13 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Table of contents ---------------------------------------------------------------------- West Coast Stouts (Randy Paul) RE: Digest for the period 1/10/02 - 1/11/02 (Paul Gatza) AHA Promotion of BJCP Competitions (Paul Gatza) Double posting (Bill Wible) Reassurance (Steve Casselman) --Next_Part_SYNC4433419E13 Content-Type: multipart/digest; boundary="Message_Part_SYNC4433419E13" --Message_Part_SYNC4433419E13 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Return-Path: Received: from ren-1.cais.net ([205.252.14.76]) by synchro.com with SMTP (Mailtraq/1.1.6.1176) id SYNC44094194FA for judge`at`synchro.com; Fri, 11 Jan 2002 01:39:02 -0500 Received: from [207.226.56.5] (ppp49.net-A.cais.net [205.252.61.49]) by ren-1.cais.net (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g0B6ctf13813 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2002 01:38:55 -0500 (EST) X-Sender: randy`at`shell.cais.com Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 01:39:32 -0500 To: JudgeNet - the beer judge digest From: Randy Paul Reply-To: "JudgeNet - the beer judge digest" Errors-To: judge-owner`at`synchro.com Sender: judge`at`synchro.com Subject: West Coast Stouts X-Hops: 3 X-POST-MessageClass: 10; Mailing List Message I'm curious why there is no category for West Coast Stouts? How have these entries been faring as specialty/experimental (quite different competing styles), as Porters (wrong roasted malt character), or as Stouts (wrong hops)? -- Randy --Message_Part_SYNC4433419E13 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Return-Path: Received: from mailman.aob.org ([206.168.226.8]) by synchro.com with SMTP (Mailtraq/1.1.6.1176) id SYNC44194199FB for judge`at`synchro.com; Fri, 11 Jan 2002 11:35:12 -0500 Received: from aob21 (unassigned.aob.org [206.168.226.14] (may be forged)) by mailman.aob.org (Build 98 8.9.3/NT-8.9.3) with SMTP id JAA04926 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2002 09:35:19 -0700 From: "Paul Gatza" Reply-To: "JudgeNet - the beer judge digest" Errors-To: judge-owner`at`synchro.com Sender: judge`at`synchro.com To: JudgeNet - the beer judge digest Subject: RE: Digest for the period 1/10/02 - 1/11/02 Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 09:35:19 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: X-Hops: 3 X-POST-MessageClass: 10; Mailing List Message Bill W. asked "Are you going to tell us that St .Pat's is the sole wholesale distributor of malt mills?" Bill, it appears that your grudge with St. Patrick's runs deep and I'm sure that you have good reasons for that, such as business that you perceived was yours may now be St. Patrick's. I believe that the homebrewing community improves when people are supporting their local shop, and that it is up to the local shop to show customers that they carry the products they desire at competitive prices. A primary message whenever Gary or Charlie or I address homebrewers is to point out the local shopkeepers in the crowd and remind homebrewers of their contribution to the community and the need to support the shop or it may not be there in the future. AHA is not in the business of policing the homebrew supply industry. We are in the business of supporting the educational and community-building aspects of homebrewing. The point of the publication was to get some basic brewing informational support in the hands of homebrewers. I set a policy for the advertising staff to follow. I think the policy is sound. We have to go by what we know about potential advertisers, due to the four-digit number of businesses we contact about different advertising and sponsorship opportunities. Other than businesses that have burned us with bad debt, we do not limit potential advertisers with the exception of this project (in order to ensure the free distribution). We have no policy for ads that may be of a questionable or offensive nature, but we would deal with the matter on a case-by-case basis if something did come up. Regarding the ad for the malt mill on page 17 of Zymurgy for Beginners, I do not know if that ad was placed by the manufacturer or St. Patrick's. It is common for a manufacturer to use the contact information of the distributor. I know the malt extract companies normally place their wholesalers info in the ad. Julia Herz, who sold the ad space in the publication, is with Redstone Meadery. I will ask her if she recalls the specifics of this ad the next time I see her. I will email you if I learn anything more. >In fact, it gives me the impression that you admit nothing, and that more of the same is on the way.> Our supply of 15,000 copies will likely run out in 2003. As I mentioned before, I may have been wrong about whether St. Patrick's qualified for inclusion in Zymurgy for Beginners at the time we were selling the ad space, based on my understanding of their business at that time. When the time comes to resell advertising space, I will contact Lynne O'Connor at St. Patrick's to address whether the business qualifies under the criteria. --Message_Part_SYNC4433419E13 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Return-Path: Received: from mailman.aob.org ([206.168.226.8]) by synchro.com with SMTP (Mailtraq/1.1.6.1176) id SYNC4419419A11 for judge`at`synchro.com; Fri, 11 Jan 2002 11:50:17 -0500 Received: from aob21 (unassigned.aob.org [206.168.226.14] (may be forged)) by mailman.aob.org (Build 98 8.9.3/NT-8.9.3) with SMTP id JAA04946 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2002 09:50:25 -0700 From: "Paul Gatza" Reply-To: "JudgeNet - the beer judge digest" Errors-To: judge-owner`at`synchro.com Sender: judge`at`synchro.com To: JudgeNet - the beer judge digest Subject: AHA Promotion of BJCP Competitions Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 09:50:25 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal X-Hops: 3 X-POST-MessageClass: 10; Mailing List Message Hi everyone. I would like people to know of a couple of minor changes in how AHA will be promoting BJCP competitions. In the past we took a passive approach to promoting BJCP competitions; that is, if a competition organizer asked us to list the BJCP-sanctioned event we would. AHA Administrator Kate Porter now is adding every BJCP-sanctioned competition to the Zymurgy and beertown calendars. Kate's Zymurgy deadline is 50 days before the month listed on the cover. So if you wish to get a competition listed in the May/June Zymurgy, it would need to appear on the BJCP calendar by March 10th. Kate can be emailed directly at mailto:kate`at`aob.org. AHA Project Coordinator Gary Glass has submitted a web change that will include a link to the BJCP site on the beertown calendar and sanctioned competition section of beertown. Paul Gatza Director--American Homebrewers Association Director--Institute for Brewing Studies Association of Brewers 736 Pearl St., Boulder, CO, USA 80302 +1.303.447.0816 ext. 122 mailto:paul`at`aob.org www.beertown.org --Message_Part_SYNC4433419E13 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Return-Path: Received: from diskless7.axs2000.net ([209.120.196.45]) by synchro.com with SMTP (Mailtraq/1.1.6.1176) id SYNC4421419AD1 for judge`at`synchro.com; Fri, 11 Jan 2002 13:24:04 -0500 Received: from [64.80.87.220] (ppp-087-220.verio.axs2000.net [64.80.87.220]) by diskless7.axs2000.net (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id g0BINff12256 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2002 13:23:41 -0500 User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 13:23:57 -0500 Subject: Double posting From: Bill Wible Reply-To: "JudgeNet - the beer judge digest" Errors-To: judge-owner`at`synchro.com Sender: judge`at`synchro.com To: JudgeNet - the beer judge digest Message-ID: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Hops: 3 X-POST-MessageClass: 10; Mailing List Message Everyone, I do not know why the most recent post I sent showed up in both of the last 2 digests. It was nothing I did - I only posted it once yesterday. I was surprised to see it show up a second time. I guess it was a computer thing. My apologies for this continuing negative thread and the double post, even though it was not intended. I will post no further on this, as I've said all I need to. I do agree with David Houseman and the others that we should move on to more positive things. Bill --Message_Part_SYNC4433419E13 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Return-Path: Received: from mta7.pltn13.pbi.net ([64.164.98.8]) by synchro.com with SMTP (Mailtraq/1.1.6.1176) id SYNC4423419B5A for judge`at`synchro.com; Fri, 11 Jan 2002 15:29:52 -0500 Received: from mail2.vcc.com ([64.174.106.246]) by mta7.pltn13.pbi.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 (built May 7 2001)) with ESMTP id <0GPS00EGUJLOP3`at`mta7.pltn13.pbi.net> for judge at synchro.com; Fri, 11 Jan 2002 12:29:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from HILBERT (hilbert [192.168.0.153]) by mail2.vcc.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 67633373F2 for ; Fri, 11 Jan 2002 12:30:23 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 12:25:16 -0800 From: Steve Casselman Reply-To: "JudgeNet - the beer judge digest" Errors-To: judge-owner`at`synchro.com Sender: judge`at`synchro.com Subject: Reassurance In-reply-to: To: JudgeNet - the beer judge digest Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal X-Hops: 3 X-POST-MessageClass: 10; Mailing List Message This will not happen again. You have to remember who is on the board of advisors. We have Pat Babcock, Louis Bonham, Mark Tumarkin, Dave Houseman along with others who don't take orders form the AHA/AOB. And we will be looking over Paul shoulder to make sure this does not happen again. You can say what ever you want about past AHA/AOB actions but you can't tell me that you distrust all the board members. So I give you my word that if anything even looks like it is not absolutely fair on this kind of point for all I will make it a point to let everyone know what is going on. I can't change the past but I (along with the rest of the board) can make sure it does not happen again. Steve Casselman --------- Bill said And your IF statement with a built in assumption does nothing to reassure me or any of the other stores who were denied advertising in this publication that it won't happen again. In fact, it gives me the impression that you admit nothing, and that more of the same --Message_Part_SYNC4433419E13-- --Next_Part_SYNC4433419E13--