Received: from srvr22.engin.umich.edu (root at srvr22.engin.umich.edu [141.212.2.35]) by srvr5.engin.umich.edu (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id BAA14575 for ; Tue, 9 Feb 1999 01:07:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from synchro.com (cccox.ne.mediaone.net [24.128.144.90]) by srvr22.engin.umich.edu (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with SMTP id BAA22788 for ; Tue, 9 Feb 1999 01:07:38 -0500 (EST) From: "JudgeNet - the beer judge digest" To: "Digest Recipients" Reply-To: "JudgeNet - the beer judge digest" Subject: Digest for the period 02/08/99 - 02/09/99 Message-ID: Date: Tue, 09 Feb 1999 01:02:09 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/digest; boundary="Next_Part_SYNC880161BB1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Hops: 1 Status: RO --Next_Part_SYNC880161BB1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Table of contents ------------------------------------------------------ perplexing behavior, maybe, maybe not (=?iso-8859-1?Q?=22Jay_Hersh_aka_Dr._Beer=AE=22?=) Recording points (Btalk at aol.com) Organizers entering their own (Stephen Johnson) Points database (Phil & Sara Doersam) Newsletter responsibility (Phil & Sara Doersam) Organizers Entering Competitions (pgarofalo at juno.com) RE: Digest for the period 02/03/99 - 02/04/99 (Charles Hudak) Encouraging newbies (cperilloux at qantas.com.au) Exam and competition schedule updates (Scott Bickham) --Next_Part_SYNC880161BB1 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Return-Path: Received: from postoffice.harvard.net by synchro.com with POP3 (Mailtraq/1.0.3.1018) id SYNC873061853; Sat, 06 Feb 1999 02:30:16 -0500 Received: (from root at localhost) by airsupply.harvard.net (8.8.8/8.8.7) id CAA07315 for postmaster at synchro.com; Sat, 6 Feb 1999 02:29:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail-out-0.tiac.net (mail-out-0.tiac.net [199.0.65.247]) by airsupply.harvard.net (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA07232 for ; Sat, 6 Feb 1999 02:28:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail-out-1.tiac.net (mail-out-1.tiac.net [199.0.65.12]) by mail-out-0.tiac.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id CAA18331 for ; Sat, 6 Feb 1999 02:30:06 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from drbeer at doctorbeer.com) Received: from drbeer (p171.block1.tc4.state.MA.tiac.com [206.119.45.172]) by mail-out-1.tiac.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id CAA17739 for ; Sat, 6 Feb 1999 02:31:46 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 6 Feb 1999 02:31:46 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199902060731.CAA17739 at mail-out-1.tiac.net> X-Sender: drbeer at pop.tiac.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: JudgeNet - the beer judge digest From: "=?iso-8859-1?Q?=22Jay_Hersh_aka_Dr._Beer=AE=22?=" Reply-To: "JudgeNet - the beer judge digest" Errors-To: judge-owner at synchro.com Sender: judge at synchro.com Subject: perplexing behavior, maybe, maybe not Apparently-To: judge at synchro.com X-Hops: 3 X-POST-MessageClass: 10; Mailing List Message Status: RO >I have had personal coorespondence with Scott in the past, by email and >phone. He has always seemed reasonable. His response, and resorting to >name calling surprises and perplexes me. Maybe it's because the people who work hard keeping this organization running get a little tired of periodically being flogged in this forum. The kind of flagelation that occurs here for sport makes hard working volunteers think REALLY HARD about just quitting and letting someone else take the abuse for a while. What's not clear is whether those dishing it out, would stand up to it were they on the receiving end. I personally don't think most of you really understand what goes into getting things done and how long things really take. I also think that few of you have been around long enough to really know much of the history of the organization, how it was damn near destroyed, and how far it has come. I took the exam the 2nd time it was given, 13 years ago. I've personally known most of the people who have kept this thing going, and have a lot of respect for all they have done in keeping it together. Does this mean that things can't be better? No. But things don't happen over night, and they don't happen by a lot of people sitting around and saying "make it so" (apologies to Patrick Stewart). I'm glad to hear Lyle has lots of experience configuring a Filemaker Pro db for Web access. Perhaps you and some others (I discussed this with Gordon Strong who also had some inkling on how to do this) can put together a detailed proposal of what it takes to set this up (HW, SW, costs, etc.). Speaking for myself I'd speculate that if the board has some hard data from people with the skills to put this together then perhaps it can be made to happen. I also hope others here payed notice to the Election announcement. I note that some of the loudest voices out here are from regions where elections are being held. Last election 3 regions were voting (it's a staggered system with 2 yr terms). Only one region (the NorthEast) had a contested election (me vs. current Board President Bill Slack who won by 5 votes but I still say he paid for them in homebrew :--). Many of the current representatives have been on the board for a while and I'd guess they may want to step down and reclaim some of the time they have committed to the BJCP for themselves. Of course knowing some of them pretty well I bet they would only do so if they knew others were on the ballot, as their commitment to the organization is such that they would probably rather stay on than see the BJCP founder for lack of leadership. So I hope that we will see some of the people who have not shrunk from sharing their opinions in this forum step up to the challenge of presenting their views on how the BJCP should be run to the voting members of their region, and if elected to be ready to stand behind them with the work it takes to see their ideas become reality. Jay (speaking for myself) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Hopfen und Malz, Gott erhalt's --Next_Part_SYNC880161BB1 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Return-Path: Received: from postoffice.harvard.net by synchro.com with POP3 (Mailtraq/1.0.3.1018) id SYNC873961875; Sat, 06 Feb 1999 11:20:08 -0500 Received: (from root at localhost) by airsupply.harvard.net (8.8.8/8.8.7) id LAA27780 for postmaster at synchro.com; Sat, 6 Feb 1999 11:17:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from imo14.mx.aol.com (imo14.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.4]) by airsupply.harvard.net (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA27721 for ; Sat, 6 Feb 1999 11:16:36 -0500 (EST) From: Btalk at aol.com Reply-To: "JudgeNet - the beer judge digest" Errors-To: judge-owner at synchro.com Sender: judge at synchro.com Received: from Btalk at aol.com by imo14.mx.aol.com (IMOv18.1) id 4FJUa05514 for ; Sat, 6 Feb 1999 11:16:45 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <428201a9.36bc6aed at aol.com> Date: Sat, 6 Feb 1999 11:16:45 EST To: JudgeNet - the beer judge digest Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Recording points Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 18 Apparently-To: judge at synchro.com X-Hops: 3 X-POST-MessageClass: 10; Mailing List Message Status: RO I find it interesting that this subject comes up. I have just emailed Paul Gatza, director of the AHA, to renew the quest for points missing from the 1997 first round Nationals in Lancaster. PA. I urge anyone concerned to contact the AHA about this particular event. regards, Bob Talkiewicz --Next_Part_SYNC880161BB1 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Return-Path: Received: from postoffice.harvard.net by synchro.com with POP3 (Mailtraq/1.0.3.1018) id SYNC874161882; Sat, 06 Feb 1999 13:02:30 -0500 Received: (from root at localhost) by airsupply.harvard.net (8.8.8/8.8.7) id NAA11063 for postmaster at synchro.com; Sat, 6 Feb 1999 13:00:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailer2.mail.vanderbilt.edu (mailer2.mail.Vanderbilt.Edu [129.59.1.212]) by airsupply.harvard.net (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA10957 for ; Sat, 6 Feb 1999 12:59:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from susan.vanderbilt.edu (A167163.N1.Vanderbilt.Edu [129.59.167.163]) by mailer2.mail.vanderbilt.edu (8.9.1a/8.9.1/VU-3.0.2) with SMTP id MAA07242 for ; Sat, 6 Feb 1999 12:00:58 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19990206120058.006a45a8 at j.mail.vanderbilt.edu> X-Sender: johnsosm at j.mail.vanderbilt.edu X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Sat, 06 Feb 1999 12:00:58 -0600 To: JudgeNet - the beer judge digest From: Stephen Johnson Reply-To: "JudgeNet - the beer judge digest" Errors-To: judge-owner at synchro.com Sender: judge at synchro.com Subject: Organizers entering their own Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Apparently-To: judge at synchro.com X-Hops: 3 X-POST-MessageClass: 10; Mailing List Message Status: RO In the Digest for 2/05-2/06, Norm Dickenson makes some good points about competition organizers and other staff members entering their beers into the competitions that they are involved with. In particular, he states that as the BJCP Competition Committee was drafting guidelines for organizers, they decided to insert a recommendation that organizers or any assistants who have had access to both bottles and entry forms ought not to enter their own competitions so as to avoid any possibility that anyone could question the integrety of the competition. I think this is an excellent point that needs to be emphasized at ALL levels of running competitions. Do whatever you can as an organizer and club to avoid any possibility that anyone could question the integrity of the competition. That involves managing an event in as professional a manner as possible. In my short time as a BJCP judge (2 years), I have seen examples of slight lapses in organizing that might lead an entrant to question the integrity of an event. I even managed to unknowingly judge one of my own beers at one event (don't worry, it didn't ribbon!)... It was the second flight in a long day and I actually had forgotten that I had entered that category! I still feel like a "newbie" when it comes to organizing our Music City Brew-Off, having two of these events under my belt. But what I have found is that there are many levels involved in demonstrating an overall view of integrity to both judges and homebrewers. I continue to learn new things each time. But the bottom line is that you need to have Standard Operating Procedures in place, in writing, for everyone involved, be it stewards, data-entry persons, or judge coordinators. Several ways we improved our logging-in procedure this past year was 1) using a computerized record-keeping system that assigned random entry numbers, and 2) distributing the process of data entry under supervised conditions across different individuals so that no one person had access to or knowledge about all of the entries. When many volunteer individuals from a club are involved in putting together a competition, it is difficult to ask any who might have some bit of "private" knowledge to refrain from entering, because the competition is as much for the members of the host club as it is for any who have entered from out-of-town. If we were to eliminate even a handful of our members from entering, it would have a significant impact on the total number of entries. This would prevent us from being able to have the high-quality event that we are trying to promote and organize. On another note, I received a quick reply to an e-mail that I sent to Ed Westemeir regarding sending him some copy for an upcoming issue of the BJCP Reporter. He was very excited to hear that and thought that I had some good ideas for some newsletter topics. He informed me that he can handle pretty much any file format via e-mail, and that he'd like to get something that could go along with the annual points update mailing, depending on when Russ Wigglesworth is going to send that out. Ed anticipates the next newsletter going out sometime between early April and late June. I also let him know that I was apologizing in advance if any of my posts on the Judge Digest had come across as being somewhat inflammatory. I did not intend for them to be a negative commentary on what he has been doing in coordinating a newsletter. His efforts are definitely appreciated from my view, and I let him know that I'd share this view on this forum. Steve Johnson, President Music City Brewers Nashville's Homebrewing Club Stephen.Johnson at vanderbilt.edu --Next_Part_SYNC880161BB1 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Return-Path: Received: from postoffice.harvard.net by synchro.com with POP3 (Mailtraq/1.0.3.1018) id SYNC874161890; Sat, 06 Feb 1999 13:14:33 -0500 Received: (from root at localhost) by airsupply.harvard.net (8.8.8/8.8.7) id NAA12339 for postmaster at synchro.com; Sat, 6 Feb 1999 13:11:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.4]) by airsupply.harvard.net (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA12294 for ; Sat, 6 Feb 1999 13:10:51 -0500 (EST) Received: (from smap at localhost) by dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id MAA14884 for ; Sat, 6 Feb 1999 12:12:06 -0600 (CST) Received: from lvx-nv3-05.ix.netcom.com(199.35.222.101) by dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma014835; Sat Feb 6 12:11:41 1999 Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19990206101006.016a7708 at popd.ix.netcom.com> X-Sender: dicepro at popd.ix.netcom.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Sat, 06 Feb 1999 10:10:06 -0800 To: JudgeNet - the beer judge digest From: Phil & Sara Doersam Reply-To: "JudgeNet - the beer judge digest" Errors-To: judge-owner at synchro.com Sender: judge at synchro.com Subject: Points database In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Apparently-To: judge at synchro.com X-Hops: 3 X-POST-MessageClass: 10; Mailing List Message Status: RO >From: Lyle C. Brown Date: Thu, 4 Feb 1999 21:31:33 -0500 >Scott's explanation of the points database is reasonable, although >perhaps uninformed. He is right about our privacy, and I appreciate that. I would love to be able to check my points database through the web. As for privacy, I personally don't care who else see's my information, but I can see how some (many?) might not want it setup that way. How about setting it up so each member's information is private unless they choose (by clicking a box or something) to make it viewable by everyone. Phil Doersam Las Vegas, Nevada BJCP Certified and GABF Beer Judge dicepro at ix.netcom.com --Next_Part_SYNC880161BB1 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Return-Path: Received: from postoffice.harvard.net by synchro.com with POP3 (Mailtraq/1.0.3.1018) id SYNC874161892; Sat, 06 Feb 1999 13:14:33 -0500 Received: (from root at localhost) by airsupply.harvard.net (8.8.8/8.8.7) id NAA12452 for postmaster at synchro.com; Sat, 6 Feb 1999 13:12:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.4]) by airsupply.harvard.net (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA12429 for ; Sat, 6 Feb 1999 13:11:58 -0500 (EST) Received: (from smap at localhost) by dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id MAA15012 for ; Sat, 6 Feb 1999 12:13:15 -0600 (CST) Received: from lvx-nv3-05.ix.netcom.com(199.35.222.101) by dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma014979; Sat Feb 6 12:12:52 1999 Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19990206101248.016a7708 at popd.ix.netcom.com> X-Sender: dicepro at popd.ix.netcom.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Sat, 06 Feb 1999 10:12:48 -0800 To: JudgeNet - the beer judge digest From: Phil & Sara Doersam Reply-To: "JudgeNet - the beer judge digest" Errors-To: judge-owner at synchro.com Sender: judge at synchro.com Subject: Newsletter responsibility In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Apparently-To: judge at synchro.com X-Hops: 3 X-POST-MessageClass: 10; Mailing List Message Status: RO >From: Chuck Bernard Date: Fri, 5 Feb 1999 09:35:05 -0600 >But when I volunteered >for the job, I also accepted the responsibilty to get a newsletter out EVERY >MONTH in time for the next meeting. It's something we promise our >memerbship; I knew that when I accepted >the job, volunteer or otherwise. It's a responsibilty I accepted and >members EXPECT to get a newsletter. Exactly the point. Well said, and BTW, you DO put out a quality newsletter. Phil Doersam Las Vegas, Nevada BJCP Certified and GABF Beer Judge dicepro at ix.netcom.com --Next_Part_SYNC880161BB1 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Return-Path: Received: from postoffice.harvard.net by synchro.com with POP3 (Mailtraq/1.0.3.1018) id SYNC8749618B5; Sat, 06 Feb 1999 21:23:12 -0500 Received: (from root at localhost) by airsupply.harvard.net (8.8.8/8.8.7) id VAA11359 for postmaster at synchro.com; Sat, 6 Feb 1999 21:20:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from m1.boston.juno.com (m1.boston.juno.com [205.231.100.199]) by airsupply.harvard.net (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA11333 for ; Sat, 6 Feb 1999 21:19:52 -0500 (EST) From: pgarofalo at juno.com Reply-To: "JudgeNet - the beer judge digest" Errors-To: judge-owner at synchro.com Sender: judge at synchro.com Received: (from pgarofalo at juno.com) by m1.boston.juno.com (queuemail) id D2TRRER8; Sat, 06 Feb 1999 21:21:08 EST To: JudgeNet - the beer judge digest Date: Sat, 6 Feb 1999 20:48:17 -0500 Subject: Organizers Entering Competitions Message-ID: <19990206.211745.19334.1.pgarofalo at juno.com> References: X-Mailer: Juno 1.49 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-2,4-7,9-11,16-25 Apparently-To: judge at synchro.com X-Hops: 3 X-POST-MessageClass: 10; Mailing List Message Status: RO Phil Doersam writes: >Can anyone tell me what the official view is on a BJCP sanctioned >competition organizer entering beers in the same competition he/she organizes? I know of no "official" view, though maybe one exists... >Should I assume this practice is commonplace in BJCP competitions, wether >entered anonymously or not? I've entered wantonly when I organized the local competition. In fact, I entered several beers of questionable quality, both to check on the quality of the judging and to (hopefully) get some feedback from an impartial source. I remember an organizer entering (and winning a category) with a silly made-up name, and I had to wonder: why bother? >Do any of you care or have an opinion about this practice? Yes. Do it. Do it until you go blind, or at least need glasses. ;-) Cheers, Peter Garofalo Syracuse, NY ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] --Next_Part_SYNC880161BB1 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Return-Path: Received: from postoffice.harvard.net by synchro.com with POP3 (Mailtraq/1.0.3.1018) id SYNC8766618E6; Sun, 07 Feb 1999 14:27:06 -0500 Received: (from root at localhost) by airsupply.harvard.net (8.8.8/8.8.7) id OAA18976 for postmaster at synchro.com; Sun, 7 Feb 1999 14:26:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.rdc1.sdca.home.com (imail at ha1.rdc1.sdca.home.com [24.0.3.66]) by airsupply.harvard.net (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA18899 for ; Sun, 7 Feb 1999 14:25:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from slug1 ([24.0.149.54]) by mail.rdc1.sdca.home.com (InterMail v4.00.03 201-229-104) with SMTP id <19990207192704.WUFW6903.mail.rdc1.sdca.home.com at slug1> for ; Sun, 7 Feb 1999 11:27:04 -0800 From: "Charles Hudak" Reply-To: "JudgeNet - the beer judge digest" Errors-To: judge-owner at synchro.com Sender: judge at synchro.com To: JudgeNet - the beer judge digest Subject: RE: Digest for the period 02/03/99 - 02/04/99 Date: Sun, 7 Feb 1999 11:35:52 -0800 Message-ID: <000001be52d1$12d19480$36950018 at slug1.dt1.sdca.home.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Apparently-To: judge at synchro.com X-Hops: 3 X-POST-MessageClass: 10; Mailing List Message Status: RO Aaron Moore writes: I am a farily new subscriber to Judge Net (>three months), and I can count the number of posts on one hand that I have seen since subscribing that live up to the statement from the BJCP web site regarding judge net...and I quote "JudgeNet is a moderated digest for the discussion of topics related to beer judging, style guidelines and homebrew competitions." I have seen very little of what is promised here, the digest does present a good forum for contest announcements (which I enjoy) and some comment on Styles, But in my opinion way too much arguing and posturing. Most of what I have seen in the last three Months is discussion of the problems (or lack there of ) with the BJCP, which is a sad deviation from what this forum is supposed to be about. Lets get back to the Beer I find it ironic that JudgeNet was down for such a lengthy period of time and finally the boys over at the HBD stepped forward on their own and started up the Beer Judge Digest. For the period of time that the BJD was up and running, the abundant posts were insightful, thought provoking and.....about Beer!! Apparently, not able to stand seeing someone else grab the baton in their "unexplainable" absence, JudgeNet got their shit together and came back online-forcing the BJD offline "Ahem, we'll take it from here thanks..." Since that time, this digest has become nothing but a forum for all the playground bullies. Not only is the posting traffic meager at best, but the subject matter rarely has anything to do with judging, beer styles or beer. I rarely do anything but scan the header anymore--reading this garbage is not worth my time. I, for one, would gladly accept the demise of this useless forum and the return of the BJD. Charles Hudak cwhudak-at-home-dot-com --Next_Part_SYNC880161BB1 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Return-Path: Received: from postoffice.harvard.net by synchro.com with POP3 (Mailtraq/1.0.3.1018) id SYNC877661938; Mon, 08 Feb 1999 00:02:53 -0500 Received: (from root at localhost) by airsupply.harvard.net (8.8.8/8.8.7) id XAA26947 for postmaster at synchro.com; Sun, 7 Feb 1999 23:59:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from wwwfw01.qantas.com.au (wwwfw01.qantas.com.au [139.163.82.1]) by airsupply.harvard.net (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA26869 for ; Sun, 7 Feb 1999 23:58:19 -0500 (EST) From: cperilloux at qantas.com.au Reply-To: "JudgeNet - the beer judge digest" Errors-To: judge-owner at synchro.com Sender: judge at synchro.com Received: (from obtuse at localhost) by wwwfw01.qantas.com.au id QAA20302 (8.8.5/IDA-1.6 for ); Mon, 8 Feb 1999 16:01:15 +1100 (EST) Received: from iissv01.qantas.com.au(139.163.105.35) via SMTP by wwwfw01-qe0, id smtpdAAA0AIPXE; Mon Feb 8 16:00:23 1999 Received: from ns-it062791.qantas.com.au (ns-it062791.qantas.com.au [139.163.63.51]) by iissv01.qantas.com.au with SMTP id PAA02311 (8.8.5/IDA-1.6 for ); Mon, 8 Feb 1999 15:58:08 +1100 (EST) Received: by ns-it062791.qantas.com.au(Lotus SMTP MTA v4.6.2 (693.3 8-11-1998)) id 4A256712.00204669 ; Mon, 8 Feb 1999 15:52:31 +1000 X-Lotus-FromDomain: QANTAS To: JudgeNet - the beer judge digest Message-ID: <4A256712.001FA607.00 at ns-it062791.qantas.com.au> Date: Mon, 8 Feb 1999 15:41:44 +1000 Subject: Encouraging newbies Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Apparently-To: judge at synchro.com X-Hops: 3 X-POST-MessageClass: 10; Mailing List Message Status: RO Hi All, Sorry to distract from the tirades, rants, and occasional sense filling up the board regarding newsletters and finances. We're working on getting more club members involved in the judging process, be they stewardsor judges. Most of our comps have relied on a handful of very experienced judges, the same ones of us every single time, and we want to get more people involved (if only so that we can get a rest sometimes!). Various clubs here have tried methods of judge training, often combining the in-house club competitions with "training" (i.e. practice), with limited success. Very occasionally, we'll have a proper training session on aromas, flavours, etc. What we've found is that we need a severely informal environment for some people to be willing to take the first step. Is this a peculiarly Australian thing, or does everyone shudder at the thought of casting judgements on other people's beer? How do you get your club members interested in the study and concentration (and fun) of judging? Calvin Perilloux Turrella, Australia --Next_Part_SYNC880161BB1 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Return-Path: Received: from postoffice.harvard.net by synchro.com with POP3 (Mailtraq/1.0.3.1018) id SYNC878761A92; Mon, 08 Feb 1999 11:27:19 -0500 Received: (from root at localhost) by airsupply.harvard.net (8.8.8/8.8.7) id LAA04708 for postmaster at synchro.com; Mon, 8 Feb 1999 11:25:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailhost3.lanl.gov (mailhost3.lanl.gov [128.165.3.9]) by airsupply.harvard.net (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA04545 for ; Mon, 8 Feb 1999 11:24:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from t4.lanl.gov (t4.lanl.gov [128.165.124.150]) by mailhost3.lanl.gov (8.9.2/8.9.2/(cic-5, 1/3/99)) with ESMTP id JAA27542 for ; Mon, 8 Feb 1999 09:26:15 -0700 (MST) Received: from atom.lanl.gov (atom.lanl.gov [128.165.124.151]) by t4.lanl.gov (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA16879 for ; Mon, 8 Feb 1999 09:26:14 -0700 (MST) Received: (from srb at localhost) by atom.lanl.gov (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA08880 for judge at synchro.com; Mon, 8 Feb 1999 09:26:14 -0700 (MST) From: Scott Bickham Reply-To: "JudgeNet - the beer judge digest" Errors-To: judge-owner at synchro.com Sender: judge at synchro.com Message-Id: <199902081626.JAA08880 at atom.lanl.gov> Subject: Exam and competition schedule updates To: JudgeNet - the beer judge digest Date: Mon, 8 Feb 1999 09:26:14 -0700 (MST) In-Reply-To: from "JudgeNet - the beer judge digest" at Feb 6, 99 01:04:54 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] Content-Type: text Apparently-To: judge at synchro.com X-Hops: 3 X-POST-MessageClass: 10; Mailing List Message Status: RO Lyle Brown wrote: > I have never found the exam and competition schedule to be anywhere near > complete, and seldom current." > > After this, Scott Bickham took exception to my comments. > > This was a fact, it was my experience. In calling my experience > "an outright lie" Scott was wrong. In resorting to name calling, I > believe Scott owes me an apology. I stated what my experience was, and > did not resort to name calling. I will not apologize. While the main BJCP web page has only recently been updated on a regular basis, I have maintained a separate BJCP exam page for the last three years. The hostsite was Clarknet when I was in Maryland and everything was transferred to Trailnet when I moved to New Mexico in August, 1997. For most of that time, clicking on the BJCP Exam Schedule header on the BJCP Home Page linked the user to my site and the current exam schedule. This exam schedule was also frequently posted to Judgenet and published in Brewing Techniques. While I have no objection to comments that the *competition* schedule was generally incomplete or out of date, that is certainly not the case with the exam schedule. I don't know where you were lurking for the past three years, but you were in no position to make such a claim about the BJCP *exam* schedule. Perhaps it was not a lie, but the reason you "never found the exam ... schedule to be ... complete" is that you did not bother looking. Scott Bickham bickham at trail.com --Next_Part_SYNC880161BB1--