Date: Fri, 13 Mar 1998 09:12:11 -0500
Message-Id: <199803131412.JAA02144 at synchro.com>
From: owner-judge-digest at synchro.com
To: judge-digest at synchro.com
Subject:   judge-digest V1 #1548
Reply-To: judge at synchro.com
Errors-To: owner-judge-digest at synchro.com
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judge-digest               Friday, 13 March 1998       Volume 01 : Number 1548

 ============================================================================
       J u d g e N e t   -   t h e   b e e r   j u d g e   d i g e s t
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 Moderator:        Chuck Cox          <chuck at synchro.com>
 Archivist:        Spencer Thomas     <spencer at umich.edu>
 Publisher:        SynchroSystems     <info at synchro.com>

 Submissions:      judge at synchro.com
 Subscriptions:    judge-request at synchro.com
 Archive:          http://realbeer.com/spencer/judge
 BJCP info:        geninfo at bjcp.synchro.com

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 contents:

 8th Spring Thing Homebrew Competition
 Re: Evolving style guidelines
 German law
 RE: BINGO!
 bigness
 Who to pick as Best of Show judges

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From: Guy Ruth <guyruth at abq-ros.com>
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 1998 05:47:08 -0700
Subject: 8th Spring Thing Homebrew Competition

Announcing the 8th Annual Dukes of Ale's Spring Thing Beer & Mead
Competition.  This is a BJCP sanctioned event.  Entry deadline is April
4th.  Judging is April 17-19.  Prospective judges should contact Jeff
Graves at jlgeag at highfiber.com or (505) 884-4335.  Stewards should
contact Sheryl Campbell at poulindsgn at aol.com or (505) 294-4610.  Rules
and forms are available at www.brewzone.com/spring_thing.html

Guy Ruth
Competition Registrar
guyruth at abq-ros.com
(505) 294-0302


------------------------------

From: Scott Bickham <srb at t4.lanl.gov>
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 1998 08:24:09 -0700 (MST)
Subject: Re: Evolving style guidelines

Greg Kushmerek wrote:

> I don't consider it heresy, but I do think that is an overly
> simplistic view.  What of bocks and doppelbocks?  I thought
> German law determined what those are precisely because of
> gravity?
> 
> I think one would have to admit that there are at least *some*
> occassions when style guidelines deserve closer adherence.

In this case, the original gravity is certainly rigid, but as
with Oktoberfests, the color of doppelbocks has decreased in the
last ten years.  I was amazed at how pale Salvator on draft was
when I tasted it in September.  Many of these breweries have
reportedly switched to infusion mashing, which could be part
of the explanation.  Fortunately, the wonderful maltiness is
still a feature.

Scott Bickham

------------------------------

From: Al Korzonas <korz at xnet.com>
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 1998 10:05:29 -0600 (CST)
Subject: German law

Greg writes:
>>    This may be viewed as heresy by some, but I always thought they
>> were called style *guidelines* because they weren't set in stone.
>> They guide, they don't dictate.
>
>I don't consider it heresy, but I do think that is an overly
>simplistic view.  What of bocks and doppelbocks?  I thought
>German law determined what those are precisely because of
>gravity?

Maybe not.  I believe the modern German laws were created to protect
the consumer (unlike Reinheitsgebot).  I believe that the law stipulates
that something labled a "Bock" must be *at least* 1.064 and something
labeled a a "Doppelbock" must be *at least* 1.072.  What leads me to
believe this is that one of the most delicious Bocks I've ever tasted
is called "St. Jakobus Blonder Bock" and is brewed by the Forschungs
brewery on the outskirts of Munchen.  It has an OG of 1.080, yet there
is no mention of "Doppel"-anything.  I'm curretnly wrestling with
what to do about this beer in the BJCP Style Guideline Committee.

Incidentally, St. Jakobus is very light and amazingly refreshing
for a 1.080 all-malt beer (it is all Pilsner malt... hence the "Blonder").
It really is deceptively strong and does taste more like a Maibock
than a Doppelbock.

Al.

------------------------------

From: Bill Giffin <billg at ctel.net>
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 1998 18:50:03 -0500
Subject: RE: BINGO!

Top of the morning to yea all,

Norman Dickenson said:
"BINGO!   It is refreshing to know that there are still rational,
reasonable folks who brew and judge because it is fun, not to adhere
to a dogma.  Independent thought survives yet another assault ;>)"

What in the world has independent thought have to do with knowingly
entering beers that exceed the competition's guidelines?  What you call
independent thought I consider sloppy brewing, carelessness, or
indifference.  Do you cheat when you play cards Norm?  Perhaps you consider
that independent thought.  Why should a beer competition be any different?

Bill


------------------------------

From: Lisa Gros <lgros at jps.net>
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 1998 17:06:46
Subject: bigness

Hello,

I think it is too simplistic to say that  if a beer is too big disqualify
it or that it should not win.  There is more too it than that. The fact of
the matter is that the beer that is slightly too big may be the closest to
the style guidelines, except in the area of bigness.  What defines a beer
as been "in style"?  Is being off  in any one element of the style enough
to say that it is not in style?  If so, then I would suggest that the
competitions I have judged at are far too generous with their scores.  Many
of the beers entered are not in style in all ways, be it color, hopping
level, body, or flavor profile etc.  whether it is intentional or not.  If
a low end doppelbock was entered in a bock category it would probably do
very well because a high end of bock is close to a low end doppelbock.
Assuming it is a well made bock, it would  score well in  the flavor
profile which holds the single largest amount of points, but get may get
docked  in the body category  (although probably not) and overall come out
with the highest point total .  A high end doppelbock, however, should not
fair well in the bock category because it is too big for style, and not
only would the body and overall impression potentially be docked, so should
the flavor profile.    Will it win the competition, that will depend on how
much it was docked as well as the other bocks in the competition.

As a judge, I have notice that my fellow  judges are becoming much more
conscious about beers that push the envelope of the style, especially when
there is one element that dominates the style, such as an IPA that is too
hoppy, or a barley wine that is over the edges.  You often hear a
discussion much more that this beer is too big for style, or too hoppy for
style.  As judges, we must constantly remind ourselves that style guideline
have ranges of  acceptablity, and that beers which are not at the extreme
of the range may actually be the better beer.

Lisa Gros
President, Draught Board Homebrewing Club
CA

------------------------------

From: George_De_Piro at berlex.com
Date: Thu, 12 Mar 1998 10:19:53 -0800
Subject: Who to pick as Best of Show judges

     Hi all,
     
     While judging a contest this past weekend, an interesting topic came 
     up in a discussion I was having with another judge.  We were judging 
     specialty beers, and molasses was listed as an ingredient in a porter 
     we were about to taste.
     
     The other judge commented that he hoped it wasn't the one he had tried 
     at a recent club meeting, because it had way too much molasses and 
     tasted pretty bad.
     
     I asked him not to "prejudge" the beer, or talk about whose beer it 
     might be.  I also mentioned to him that it is common for people to 
     recognize their clubmate's beers at the local contest.  You just have 
     to try to be objective and impartial.
     
     I also told him that was the reason the BOS judges at the recent 
     Brooklyn contest were all from out of town.  I didn't want anybody 
     recognizing a local beer in the BOS panel (which did happen to us a 
     couple of years earlier at our Belgian only contest).
     
     It is impossible to avoid such occurrences in the early flights, but 
     if you have enough out of town judges, I think they should be used 
     exclusively for BOS.  It's also a nice way to reward them for going 
     out of their way to help out at your contest.
     
     Have fun!
     
     George De Piro  (Nyack, NY)

------------------------------

End of judge-digest V1 #1548
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