Return-Path: owner-judge at synchro.com Received: from srvr20.engin.umich.edu (root at srvr20.engin.umich.edu [141.212.2.26]) by srvr5.engin.umich.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA21086 for ; Fri, 28 Mar 1997 13:49:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from judgmentday.rs.itd.umich.edu (0 at judgmentday.rs.itd.umich.edu [141.211.83.37]) by srvr20.engin.umich.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA08424 for ; Fri, 28 Mar 1997 13:49:24 -0500 (EST) Received: by judgmentday.rs.itd.umich.edu (8.7.5/2.2) with X.500 id NAA29022; Fri, 28 Mar 1997 13:49:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from uu6.psi.com by judgmentday.rs.itd.umich.edu (8.7.5/2.2) with SMTP id NAA28998; Fri, 28 Mar 1997 13:49:18 -0500 (EST) Received: by uu6.psi.com (5.65b/4.0.071791-PSI/PSINet) via UUCP; id AA07019 for spencer at umich.edu; Fri, 28 Mar 97 13:49:16 -0500 Received: (from majordom at localhost) by synchro.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id NAA13219 for judge-digest-outgoing; Fri, 28 Mar 1997 13:14:03 -0500 Date: Fri, 28 Mar 1997 13:14:03 -0500 Message-Id: <199703281814.NAA13219 at synchro.com> From: owner-judge-digest at synchro.com To: judge-digest at synchro.com Subject: judge-digest V1 #1414 Reply-To: judge at synchro.com Errors-To: owner-judge-digest at synchro.com Precedence: bulk judge-digest Friday, 28 March 1997 Volume 01 : Number 1414 ============================================================================ J u d g e N e t - t h e b e e r j u d g e d i g e s t ============================================================================ Moderator: Chuck Cox Archivist: Spencer Thomas Publisher: SynchroSystems Submissions: judge at synchro.com Subscriptions: judge-request at synchro.com Archive: http://realbeer.com/spencer/judge BJCP info: geninfo at bjcp.synchro.com ============================================================================ contents: Re: Computers during Judging This May Be Heresy Competition categories Re: Missing the point Guidelines as Entry Categor NHC '97 Western Regional - Call for Judges 6th ann. NYC Spring Comp Results ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Barry DeLapp Date: Thu, 27 Mar 1997 11:10:28 -0500 Subject: Re: Computers during Judging Bill Giffin feels it is necessary to SHOUT that he does not want computers involved with judging due to slowing down the event and data integrity problems. That's most curious because that is exactly why I created software to manage an event. With good software the organizers spend a fraction of the time preparing for the event -- we have proven this over and over. When it comes to data integrity, I know I have gotten back comments about somebody else's beer (color comments are a dead give-away) for one of my entries. As a profession DATA COLLECTION ANALYST I think I know something about data integrity. My first version of software was entirely Bar Coded! Since no one else has my equipment, I removed that and put in double entry checks to limit errors. Good software will reduce errors over manual operations. Again, I don't care what anyone else does, but I will always use a computer to run a beer competition. Now that I have the names and addresses of 90% of homebrewers in the Philadelphia area, the data entry of several hundred beers takes just a few hours. In half a day we have the whole operation set up ... the time consuming part is just labeling and organizing the bottles. Instead of saying it can't be done, study how it has been done effectively and go on with life. - -- Barry DeLapp barry at pictorl.com (610) 648-3980 (610) 648-3983 fax ------------------------------ From: "Doug A. Mccullough" Date: Thu, 27 Mar 1997 09:41:33 -0600 Subject: This May Be Heresy Greetings to all: Twelve others and I in the Birmingham BrewMasters have been studying diligently since January to take the BJCP exam in May. Near the middle of our thirteen weekly study sessions the BJCP released Style Guidelines that diverge significantly from the AHA's. Our mentor informs us that we had better be prepared to answer exam questions per the BJCP Guidelines and not the AHA's. Isn't the exam tough enough without this added level of obfuscation? In the same vein, don't entrants have a right to know whether the Style Guidelines against which their beers will be judged will be the BJCP's or the AHA's? I am not seeing that specified in contest announcements. Rather than further balkanize the homebrewing hobby, perhaps the BJCP should explore cooperation and consolidation. The current environment diminishes both the AJA and BJCP. Doug McCullough Birmingham, AL ------------------------------ From: Bill Giffin Date: Thu, 27 Mar 1997 10:43:41 -0600 Subject: Competition categories Top of the morning to ye all, Russ Wigglesworth : >Defining styles of beer which are either currently commercially available or can be historically documented is not the same thing as setting parameters for homebrew competition entries. Competition categories should be determined based upon the size and resources of the specific competition as well as the targeted entrants. > Wonderful!!! A competition doesn't have to have all the possible categories allowed, nor should it. Make your competition be what you want it to be not a miny NHC. Cut your categories to what you can manage not what you think the brewer would like to enter. Improve the brewer's skills by only allowing a few styles of beer, or even make up you own style and force the brewer to brew a beer that you would like to try. Bill ------------------------------ From: Dion Hollenbeck Date: 27 Mar 1997 09:49:19 -0800 Subject: Re: Missing the point >> Rad Equipment writes: RW> Granted some organizers may choose to use them as such but RW> generally they will not be used for this purpose. Every RW> competition has the freedom to define its own entry RW> categories. With any luck these categories will be built on styles RW> which are described in the Style Guidelines but they need not RW> follow the format of the guidelines when establishing entry RW> categories. You make a very good point here, but people still seem to be missing the point I have been trying to make. We (as well as many other competitions as well) have enough regional brewers to draw over 200 beers and have entries in ALL of the AHA categories (well, at least we had 27 out of 28). If we get this kind of participation, then we don't want to collapse or limit categories, we want to use them all. Are we in the minority by having a competition that can use all the categories? What we want to do is to have a single widely published set of guidelines to which we can REFER people. Guidelines which are easy for people to obtain, people without any computer access!!! The bottom line is saving money on the competition so that we can keep our entry fees low. Sure, I could bump the entry fees a dollar per bottle and produce a set of guidelines with every packet, and up the postage as well, but why should the brewers have to pay more money? Our club is not out to make a fortune from competitions, but if we lose money we cannot keep putting them on. Postage and copying of materials is one place where there is a little control on money spent without sacrificing quality of the competition for either entrants or judges, and it is also one of our single largest expenditures outside of food. Our entry fees are currently $6 for the first entry and $4 for every subsequent entry. How does this compare with other comps? Would you as a brewer be willing to pay an extra dollar per entry so that I can send out a set of style guidelines with every packet? Why should I punish you financially if you can get the guidelines online and don't need them mailed out to you? dion Organizer America's Finest City Homebrew Competition March 8, 1997 Quality Ale and Fermentation Fraternity, Sponsor http://www.vigra.com/~hollen/AFCHBC.html - --- Dion Hollenbeck (619)597-7080x164 Email: hollen at vigra.com http://www.vigra.com/~hollen Sr. Software Engineer - Vigra Div. of Visicom Labs San Diego, California ------------------------------ From: "Rad Equipment" Date: 27 Mar 1997 15:39:48 U Subject: Guidelines as Entry Categor Subject: Guidelines as Entry Categories Time:3:35 PM Date:3/27/97 dion (et al); I can fully appreciate your desire to see guidelines published so that you do not need to include them with your mailing to your entrants thus driving up printing and postage costs for your event. My position has been that very few competitions would use the Style Guidelines in their exact format to define their entry categories and so would have to distribute their own descriptors anyway. I may be wrong. Possibly your format is on the rise and more and more organizers will perform as you do. Since my experience is from the days prior to the format of the AHA NHC, and since my club (and many in the Bay Area) is historically not AHA supportive, it is possible that my concept of competitions being created to be unique in character (as far as the categories are concerned) is somewhat skewed. Perhaps it is time to gather some data from the competition organizers across the country to see just how people are doing things. I have to say that I am not in favor of suggesting that everyone follow the same format for their competitions. I know there is a faction out there which advocates such uniformity but I do not support them. Competitions should be like homebrews and homebrewers. Each one should have a unique "house character". Beer style definitions and judging procedures, on the other hand, are another matter... RW... Russ Wigglesworth (INTERNET: Rad_Equipment at radmac1.ucsf.edu - RussWig at aol.com) UCSF Dept. of Radiology, San Francisco, CA (415) 476-3668 / Home (707) 769-0425 ------------------------------ From: Lowell Hart Date: Thu, 27 Mar 1997 22:23:00 Subject: NHC '97 Western Regional - Call for Judges Date: Thu, 27 Mar 1997 21:01:51 To: lhart at cati.csufresno.edu From: Lowell Hart Subject: NHC '97 Western Regional - Call for Judges Beer Ye! Beer Ye! >From the Bench of the Chief Justice of the Supreme Quart The Honorable William D. McCrory presiding. All BJCP Judges are hereby called to the bar. Your judging expertise is required to adjudicate a matter of the greatest import: The American Homebrewers Association 1997 National Homebrew Competition Western Regional First Round. Proceedings will be called to order on the evening of Friday, May 16, 1997 and run through Sunday, May 18. Court will be held at California State University, Fresno's Enology Building, and for the third consecutive year we have the great fortune to have the help of the CSUF Enology Society and use of their Sensory Evaluation Room. NOTE: Failure to appear will result in severe penalties, including but not limited to: a) not being here for the festivities, b) missing a chance to judge the best homebrews from California and Nevada, c) foregoing a barbeque dinner with live entertainment, d) not getting to taste products of the 1997 Commemorative Brewing Program.* *experienced and adventurous volunteer brewers exploring the various and sundry style possibilites of identical lots of ingredients, and you get to drink it Further information is contained in the attached documents. Upon receipt of your registration form a written confirmation will be dispatched by return mail. Direct responses, writs and other correspondence to: Bill McCrory 17930 Road 220 Porterville, California 93257 (209) 784-3816 OR lhart at lightspeed.net Yours Brewly, The Honorable William D. McCrory American Homebrew Association 1997 National Homebrew Competition Western Regional First Round May 16, 17 & 18, 1997 California State University, Fresno Enology Building, Sensory Evaluation Room Barstow Avenue, Fresno We would like to welcome and encourage the participation of all qualified beer judges from throughout the region. Please take this chance to meet some of the most experienced and knowledgeable brewing enthusiasts you're likely to see assembled in one place. As entries from Nevada are to be included in the Western region this year we anticipate a full cellar of entries, and thus will need a large group of judges for the entire weekend and all sessions. Please return this form to the address below by May 5th. Panels will be filled as responses are received. A card confirming your registration will be sent upon receipt. Thank you for your help, and we look forward to seeing you all there. Session Schedule Friday, May 16, 1997 7-9 pm Saturday, May 17, 1997 9-11 am, 1-3 pm Sunday, May 18, 1997 9-11 am, 1-3 pm Check-in opens one hour before judging begins. Breakfast snack and hearty lunch provided to all participants. Knowledgeable friends are welcome as stewards. BJCP points awarded liberally.... Other Event Info: Lowell Hart Organizer voice (209)486-5702 fax (209)322-9204 e-mail lhart at lightspeed.net AHA 1997 National Homebrew Competition Western Regional First Round 3rd Annual Tri-tip Barbecue and Homebrew Tasting Saturday Evening, May 17, 1997 5:00 pm O'Neill Park Barstow Avenue California State University, Fresno This year's entertainment line-up: Brian Kenney plays the Chapman Stick Glen Delpit plays his brand of roots/acoustic blues The Roger Perry Band plays more music than any 3 ordinary bands combined Look for door prizes, a raffle, and a people's choice award. ------------------------------ From: Ken Date: Fri, 28 Mar 1997 09:34:37 -0500 Subject: 6th ann. NYC Spring Comp Results Results for the 1997 NYC Spring Regional Competition can be found at the HOSI web site. URL http://www.wp.com/hosi/ BOS was won by a Frank Salt with cider. 1st runner up was Matt Wyss with an Americxan light lager and 2nd. runner up was Ken Johnsen with a dry stout Total entries were 224 %%% overflow headers %%% To: deidre at nycbeer.org (Deidre Hinds), FuzzC at aol.com (Rob Collins), arichter at haven.ios.com (Alan Richter), EvilOne at Erols.com (Steve buonocore), bill.brothers at dscmail.com (Bill Brothers), levine at ios.com (Jeff Levine), StanM13541 at aol.com, Bill_Marks at ids.net (Bill Marks), mcnallyg at in83b.npt.nuwc.navy.mil, staples at ibm.net (Dana Staples), scost at ieee.org (Scott Cost), Member4291 at aol.com, Tossbergjt at Phibred.com (John Tussberg), cgoll at cc-mail.pica.army.mil (Chris Goll), WOLFF at eclus.bwi.wec.com (Bob Wolf), t.duchesneau at genie.com (Tom Duuchesn), jay at ro.com (Jay Reeves), SSMITH1 at drew.edu, richroso at msn.com (Rich Rosowski), WindGust at aol.com, jds at equinox.shaysnet.com, snyder at shore.intercom.net (Steve Snyder), petet at epix.net (Pete Tarutis), bcombs at powercc.com (Brian Combs), jay at ro.com (Jay Reeves), JKHOPS at worldnet.att.net (Jason Kohl), fcmbh at access.digex.net (Fred Hardy), flanagan at webspan.net (Tom Flanagan), jformane at uiuc.edu (Joe Formanek), henryj at dns.thewebcorp.com, cruth at analogic.com, schd at pluto.njcc.com, 102605.3033 at compuserve.com, rkwells at wizrealm.com, Everbrew at aol.com, mfralick at mc.net (Brewmasters), schd at pluto.njcc.com (Princeton HB), Joece at msn.com (Joseph Cettina), ZEricks at aol.com, santerre at cps.gonzaga.edu, POPPSS at aol.com, kcoones at bcn.net, dugarm at mnsinc.com, rbabcock at rmii.com, Dennis_Murray at Medec.com, maddie at sover.net, TCAHALANE at worldnet.att.net (Tom Cahalane), Thomas.Cahalane at ABCNY.WWABC.ABC.sprint.com, RUDYGIO at aol.com (Rudy Giordano), NYGIO at NY.UBS.com (Rudy Giordano at work), kbjohns at escape.com (Ken Johnsen), eshaugh at chelsea.ios.com (Ed Shaughnessy), MOEBREW at aol.com (John DeGeorge), mike at patsy.hunter.cuny.edu (Mike Pencak), lough at students.uiuc.edu (John Lough), jonkar at pipeline.com (Jon Schulman), DJHack666 at gnn.com (Steven Santoro), blarkin0 at counsel.com (Brian Larkin), tomko at nycmetro.com (Tom Kolalowski), GFXSYS at aol.com (Jim Justino), !jlinsalata at attmail.com (Jim Linsalata), GarettiK at fairchildpub.com (Kathie Garretti), timmyb at oscar.peakaccess.net, tmcirvin at nycmetro.com, judge at synchro.com, homebrew at brew.oeonline.com %%% end overflow headers %%% ------------------------------ End of judge-digest V1 #1414 **************************** Send subscription cancellations & changes to judge-request at synchro.com. 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