From synchro!judge-owner at uu6.psi.com Tue May 2 04:18:25 1995 Status: O X-VM-v5-Data: ([nil t nil nil nil nil nil nil nil] ["43207" "" " 2" "May" "1995" "02:19:42" "EDT" "JudgeNet Administrator" "judge-owner at synchro.com" nil "829" "JudgeNet Digest #1033 (May 02, 1995)" "^Date:" nil nil "5" nil nil nil nil] nil) Received: by judgmentday.rs.itd.umich.edu (8.6.12/2.2) with X.500 id EAA11942; Tue, 2 May 1995 04:18:21 -0400 Received: from goodman.itn.med.umich.edu by judgmentday.rs.itd.umich.edu (8.6.12/2.2) with SMTP id EAA11937; Tue, 2 May 1995 04:18:20 -0400 Received: from uu6.psi.com by goodman.itn.med.umich.edu with SMTP id AA04966 (5.65b/IDA-1.4.3 for spencer at umich.edu); Tue, 2 May 95 04:18:18 -0400 Received: from synchro.UUCP by uu6.psi.com (5.65b/4.0.071791-PSI/PSINet) via UUCP; id AA06353 for ; Tue, 2 May 95 04:05:20 -0400 Received: by synchro.com (smail2.5) id AA13797; 2 May 95 02:19:42 EDT (Tue) Reply-To: judge at synchro.com (JudgeNet) Errors-To: judge-error at synchro.com Precedence: bulk Message-Id: <9505020219.AA13797 at synchro.com> Date: 2 May 95 02:19:42 EDT (Tue) From: judge-owner at synchro.com (JudgeNet Administrator) To: judge-recipients at synchro.com (JudgeNet Recipients) Subject: JudgeNet Digest #1033 (May 02, 1995) JudgeNet Digest #1033 Tue 02 May 1995 JudgeNet The Beer Judge Digest digest submissions: judge at synchro.com administrative requests: judge-request at synchro.com send cancellations & rank updates to the administrative address messages sent to the wrong address will be ignored FTP Archives: guraldi.hgp.med.umich.edu in /pub/judge WWW Archives: http://guraldi.hgp.med.umich.edu/Beer/Judge Gopher Archives: guraldi.hgp.med.umich.edu Editor: Chuck Cox Archivist: Spencer Thomas Publishers: SynchroSystems and the Riverside Garage & Brewery Anti-Prohibitionists may also be interested in LiBeerty: The Libertarian Beer Digest Subscription info: libeerty-request at synchro.com Contents: Who's Who (Mailing list Admin) Re: JudgeNet Digest #1032 (May 01, 1995) (McKee Smith) Re:Calibration beers (GSMITHBEER) Beers too cold at AHA Chicago Regional - oops ("Roger Deschner ") Lost and Found in Chicago ("Roger Deschner ") Scoring/that dreaded little box (Algis R Korzonas +1 708 979 8583) 1050 Ordinary (Algis R Korzonas +1 708 979 8583) NorthEast Database ("Kieran O'Connor") JA / Can't we all get along? (uswlsrap) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 1 May 95 9:17:42 EDT From: listadm at synchro.com (Mailing list Admin) Subject: Who's Who ###################################################################### ## ## ## JudgeNet - the beer judge digest ## ## ## ## subscriber list ## ## ## ## (addresses prefaced with '#' are relayed) ## ## ## ## copyright (c) 1995 C.C.Cox ## ## ## ## this information may not be redistributed or ## ## used for commercial purposes ## ## ## ###################################################################### # ### Relay Sites # beer.judge at f615.n109.z1.fidonet.org (The Enlightened Board) # ### Federation of Amateur Wine and Beer Guilds (FAWBG) - NL # # Master Wine Judge # victor.reijs at surfnet.nl (Victor Reijs) # ### National Guild of Wine and Beer Judges (NGWBJ) - UK # # Examiner # g.a.cooper at gre.ac.uk (Geoff Cooper) # ### Beer Judge Certification Program (BJCP) - North America # # Co-Director # 74443.3040 at compuserve.com (Pat Baker) # # Associate Director # tayres at aol.com (Tom Ayers) # # Committee Representatives # wknn70a at prodigy.com (Rob Bates) bickham at msc.cornell.edu (Scott Bickham) stupidtoad at aol.com (Scott Birdwell) norman.dickenson at sonoma.edu (Norman Dickenson) gsmithbeer at eworld.com (Gregg Smith) strouds at polaroid.com (Steve Stroud) rad_equipment at radmac1.ucsf.edu (Russ Wigglesworth) # # Unofficial Database & Email Administrator # chuck at synchro.com (Chuck Cox) # # Master Judges # mferts at taec.com (Mike Fertsch) 75471.503 at compuserve.com (Philip Fleming) hersh at x.org (Jay Hersh) korz at iepubj.att.com (Al Korzonas) darrylri at microsoft.com (Darryl Richman) #74443.3040 at compuserve.com (Betty-Ann Sather) # # National Judges # tartz at btg.com (Tim Artz) mdhb07e at prodigy.com (John Dale) steved at ptdcs2.intel.com (Steve Dempsey) farnsworth at eworld.com (Paul Farnsworth) judge-relay at semantic.rsi.com (Bob Gorman) hall at buffa.enet.dec.com (Dan Hall) shamburg at mcs.com (Steve Hamburg) jim at dwrock.dw.att.com (Jim Homer) dlh1 at trpo3.tredydev.unisys.com (David Houseman) isenhour at alexia.lis.uiuc.edu (John Isenhour) alkinchen at aol.com (Al Kinchen) afmccaul at rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu (Tony Mccauley) danmcc at umich.edu (Dan McConnell) glo at lanl.gov (Gordon Olson) rhreed at icdc.delcoelect.com (Rob Reed) walzenbrew at aol.com (Gregory Walz) hopfen at iac.net (Ed Westemeier) boskoduck at aol.com (Julian Zelazny) # # Certified Judges # tony at spss.com (Tony Babinec) jack at wubios.wustl.edu (Jack Baty) baughmankr at conrad.appstate.edu (Kinney Baughman) sblack at mail.utexas.edu (Steve Black) dlbrain at hops.entertain.com (Dan Brainard) bronson at mcs.com (Edward Bronson) leeb at southwind.net (Lee Bussy) r.call at genie.geis.com (Ray Call) akcs.chrisc at vpnet.chi.il.us (Chris Campanelli) jcarlson at du.edu (John Carlson) lcarter at claven.idbsu.edu (Loren Carter) cave at psc.org (Jim Cave) rcbeer at aol.com (Ralph Colaizzi) ddavison at execpc.com (Dennis Davison) TimStrange at aol.com (Timothy Dawson) jdecarlo at mitre.org (John DeCarlo) rdevine at microsoft.com (Bob Devine) fjdobner at intgp1.att.com (Frank Dobner) brewnews at aol.com (Phil Doersam) pedwards at iquest.net (Paul Edwards) jimme at arc.umn.edu (Jim Ellingson) monk at vnet.ibm.com (Richard Evans) farreln at ppco.com (Norman Farrell) nfarrell at charon.ppco.com (Norman Farrell) allen at darwin.sfbr.org (Allen Ford) gummitch at techbook.com (Jeff Frane) garofalo at aol.com (Peter Garofalo) rgarvin at btg.com (Rick Garvin) billg at giffin.iii.net (Bill Giffin) doublegg at delphi.com (Gregg Glaser) greenlee at tyrell.net (Ed Greenlee) hall at lanl.gov (Michael Hall) fcmbh at access.digex.net (Fred Hardy) charris at u.washington.edu (Craig Harris) hauptbrau at aol.com (Jess Haupt) doug at techbook.com (Doug Henderson) Mhenry at cheswicks.toadnet.org (Matt Henry) holton at minnie.nic.kingston.ibm.com (Greg Holton) klein at physics.berkeley.edu (David Klein) jlandreman at atmel.com (John Landreman) rick at adc.com (Rick Larson) mjl at uncvx1.oit.unc.edu (Mike Lelivelt) jel3 at cornell.edu (John Lenz) g8006142 at mcmail.cis.mcmaster.ca (Michael Ligas) ed.lingel at tek.com (Ed Lingel) malodah at pacbell.com (Martin Lodahl) larrylf at taligent.com (Larry Lynch-Freshner) tedm at cv.hp.com (Ted Manahan) daniel.f.mcconnell at med.umich.edu (Daniel McConnell) brownale at aol.com (Charlie Milan) idnemeth at gate.id.iit.edu (Christopher Nemeth) koconnor at mailbox.syr.edu (Kieran O'Connor) ckp at acpub.duke.edu (Craig Pepin) edm at fox.nstn.ns.ca (Jeff Pinhey) 76152.3474 at compuserve.com (Randy Powell) nerenner at umich.edu (Jeff Renner) resch at rmii.com (Dave Resch) ridgely at a1.cber.fda.gov (Bill Ridgely) ross at mscf.med.upenn.edu (Andy Ross) aaswr at asuvm.inre.asu.edu (Steve Russell) brad.seibert at den.mmc.com (Brad Seibert) d_simon at fallout.lonestar.org (Darrell Simon) d_simon at lonestar.fallout.org (Darrell Simon) wrs at gozer.mv.com (Bill Slack) spsbeer at ins.infonet.net (Mike Snyder) brewsmead at eworld.com (Bruce Stevens) stokes at maine.maine.edu (Martin Stokes) spencer.w.thomas at med.umich.edu (Spencer Thomas) gtinseth at teleport.com (Glenn Tinseth) walter at lamar.colostate.edu (Brian Walter) whbob at arcane.ucsd.edu (Robert Whritner) wolfe at act-12-po.act.org (Ed Wolfe) wolf0028 at gold.tc.umn.edu (Ron Wolfgram) # # Recognized Judges # baier_t at salt.plu.edu (Tom Baier) chrisb3 at ix.netcom.com (Chris Balboni) bill.batzer at travel.com (Bill Batzer) jeffb at shore.net (Jeff Biegert) bradley at adx.adelphi.edu (Rob Bradley) 74630.730 at compuserve.com (Dave Brown) jbrown at earth.execpc.com (Jeffrey Brown) cannon_tom at hq.navsea.navy.mil (Tom Cannon) gcb at fc.hp.com (Glenn Colon-Bonet) james at krl.com (James Cox) lynnd at ihs.com (Lynn Danielson) rmdavis at mocan.mobil.com (Randy Davis) u52983 at uicvm.uic.edu (Roger Deschner) dipalma at sky.com (Jim DiPalma) docherty at arco.com (Shane Docherty) adugarm at worldbank.org (Delano DuGarm) erickson_rb at atc.alcoa.com (Rolf Erickson) tee at cray.com (Tony Ernst) #bruce.feist at f615.n109.z1.fidonet.org (Bruce Feist) 71064.1725 at compuserve.com (Chris Folta) fordcy at splava.cc.plattsburgh.edu (Chris Ford) froeh at jpats.ecc.naa.rockwell.com (Michael Froehlich) fusco at io.org (Carlo Fusco) gellym at aviion.persoft.com (Mitch Gelly) #polly.goldman at f615.n109.z1.fidonet.org (Polly Goldman) brewdaddy at aol.com (Chuck Gollay) graff008 at maroon.tc.umn.edu (Kurt Graffunder) msgresni at cacd.rockwell.com (Mike Gresnick) brew at devine.columbiasc.ncr.com (Jim Griggers) bhall at sparc.ecology.uga.edu (Bob Hall) joseph at joebloe.maple-shade.nj.us (Joseph_N Hall) 73734.3727 at compuserve.com (Ross Hastings) jhinken at aol.com (Jim Hinken) ehitchcock at sparc.uccb.ns.ca (Ed Hitchcock) holton at donald.aix.kingston.ibm.com (Greg Holton) jones_sa at atc.alcoa.com (Steven Jones) kiestc at peak.org (Cary Kiest) 72456.2530 at compuserve.com (Roy Klein) sklump at freenet.columbus.oh.us (Stephen Klump) plfrog at aol.com (Peter LaFrance) delbrew at pgh.nauticom.net (Nathaniel Lansing) jleak at vnet.ibm.com (John Leak) fjl at dpci.sannet.gov (Frank Leers) trl at wuerl.wustl.edu (Tom Leith) rich at lenihan.iii.net (Rich Lenihan) bplewis at mocan.mobil.com (Brian Lewis) jliddil at azcc.arizona.edu (Jim Liddil) manning_martin_mp at mcst.ae.ge.com (Martin Manning) matmanning at aol.com (Matt Manning) mare at vetsci.agpharm.arizona.edu (John Mare) tmartyn at aol.com (Tom Martyn) r.mcglew3 at genie.geis.com (Ray McGlew) asm at med.unc.edu (Andrew McKenzie) emeeks at tx.ncsu.edu (Ed Meeks) pmiller at mmm.com (Phil Miller) scott at gordian.com (Scott Murphy) johnmo123 at aol.com (John O'Neal) t.olsen at genie.geis.com (Tim Olsen) cdpalmer at aol.com (Charles Palmer) uswlsrap at ibmmail.com (Robert Paolino) andnator at genesis.mcs.com (Andrew Patrick) piatz at cray.com (Steve Piatz) kjbrew at aol.com (Ken Rich) ja_rosen at qmail4.nba.TRW.com (Joel Rosen) drudolph at ix.netcom.com (Don Rudolph) rsantore at mailbox.syr.edu (Robert Santore) shoej at aol.com (David Schoemaker) p00644 at psilink.com (Phillip Seitz) skeel at fcrfv2.ncifcrf.gov (Alison Skeel) Mcksmith at iadfw.net (McKee Smith) mcksmi at delphi.com (McKee Smith) sterner at cv.hp.com (John Sterner) stevens at stsci.edu (Mark Stevens) sullivan51 at aol.com (John Sullivan) kurt.swanson at dna.lth.se (Kurt Swanson) btalk at aol.com (bob talkiewicz) terfintt at ttown.apci.com (Terry Terfinko) twaldon at fcc.gov (Tracy Waldon) beerwriter at aol.com (Alan Wax) rbw1271 at appenine.ca.boeing.com (Richard Webb) swh at ll.mit.edu (Sarah White) lowguy at aol.com (Gilbert_Scott Wolfe) bmw at teleport.com (Brad Woods) wotring at sluvca.slu.edu (Ginger Wotring) # # Apprentice Judges # j_adams at sde.hp.com (John Adams) 74444.1666 at compuserve.com (Jon Allen) docsbrew at aol.com (Larry Allen) allison2 at gene.com (David Allison) anderegg at divnc.com (Murray Anderegg) kit.anderson at acornbbs.com (Kit Anderson) paul at grammatech.com (Paul Anderson) atkinson at unt.edu (Sam Atkinson) thomas.w.ausfeld at dartmouth.edu (Tom Ausfeld) ballhorn at optimage.com (Bill Ballhorn) 75250.1350 at compuserve.com (Karen Barela) scott at partech.com (Scott Barrett) dbeedle at rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu (Dave Beedle) jerry.bell at mccaw.com (Jerry Bell) bellakc at axe.humboldt.edu (Cary Bellak) gunnarb at stavanger.sgp.slb.com (Gunnar Berge) jeremybb at leland.stanford.edu (Jeremy Bergsman) michael at wupsych.wustl.edu (Mike Biondo) mole at netcom.com (Aaron Birenboim) bliss at convex.com (Brian Bliss) blue at cam.nist.gov (Jim Blue) lkbonham at beerlaw.win.net (Louis Bonham) dougbooth at aol.com (Doug Booth) anders.bostrom at mollehem.se (Anders Bostrom) paul.bourret at swamplands.com (Paul Bourret) mbovee at rex.uokhsc.edu (Mike Bovee) embreed at sfovmic1.vnet.ibm.com (Emily Breed) bli at psuvm.psu.edu (Jeff Brendle) munches at aol.com (Jim Brennan) eddie-brian at uiowa.edu (Eddie Brian) ray at hwr.arizona.edu (Ray Brice) jbbs at aol.com (Joe_Bob Briggs-Stratton) bronyaur at u.washington.edu (David Brockington) muh84 at aol.com (Kevin Brooks) brosnihan at aol.com (Frank Brosnihan) jpbrewing at aol.com (Jeffrey Brown) bbrowne at golder.com (Barry Browne) beb at pt.com (Bruce Buck) fred at animal.ufl.edu (fred buhl) bbumbarg at acc.haverford.edu (Bruce Bumbarger) dbussell at aol.COM (David Bussell) adc at mvuts.att.com (Alexander Carr) charlie at halcyon.com (Charles Castellow) fchambers at aol.com (Frederick_M Chambers) buel_chandler at fmso.navy.mil (Buel Chandler) nc6967 at conrad.appstate.edu (Nathan Clark) 0002419419 at mcimail.com (Tom Clifton) coffel at crl.com (Karen Coffel) karen.coffel at ncal.kaiperm.org (karen coffel) zz11p9c at pentagon-emh6.army.mil (Peter Cooke) brew4u at aol.com (Paul Corbett) cottong at norand.com (Gary Cotton) edcuz at aol.com (Ed Cousineau) 7059940 at mcimail.com (Harry Covert) scox at factset.com (Sean Cox) andrewcr at microsoft.com (Andrew Craze) mcrews at aol.com (Marshall Crews) mandos at carson.u.washington.edu (Marvin Crippen) crumj at bcc.orst.edu (Jennifer Crum) dalton at subpac.enet.dec.com (Tim Dalton) darling_ge at brutus.vought.com (Jerry Darling) sdd6 at cornell.edu (Steve Daughhetee) psd1 at midway.uchicago.edu (Pratik Dave) briand at vt.edu (Brian Davidson) davidson at emba.uvm.edu (Darryl Davidson) palmer at ansoft.com (Palmer Davis) wd22dd at sun1.wwb.noaa.gov (Dennis Deaven) jdelapp at halcyon.com (John DeLapp) pauld at aristotle.saic.com (Paul Demmert) tdenny at rigel.cs.pdx.edu (Tom Denny) ldent at crash.colorado.edu (Logan Dent) aderr at bbn.com (Alan Derr) sderose at smirror.tezcat.com (Steve De_Rose) sregan at interlog.com (Phil Difonzo) tom_doak at hlthsci.med.utah.edu (Tom Doak) jgdoyle at uci.edu (Jim Doyle) ded1 at cornell.edu (David Drinkwater) akcs.jebel at vpnet.chi.il.us (Jason Ebel) kilers at aol.com. (Kevin Eilers) chrisbac at rice.edu (Chris Eisbach) 73627.3144 at compuserve.com (David Elliott) prismbus at aol.com (Michael Erickson) sescorza at sdcc3.ucsd.edu (Sergio Escorza) darren at ua1vm.ua.edu (Darren Evans-Young) cdewen at ids.net (Charles Ewen) ron.ezetta at tek.com (Ron Ezetta) mfetzer at ucsd.edu (Michael Fetzer) pblshr at aol.com (Tom Finan) jimfitz at netcom.com (Jim Fitzgerald) fitz at fasicsv.fnal.gov (Tom Fitzpatrick) gjfix at utamat.uta.edu (George Fix) john.fix at hardgood.com (John Fix) dennisf at denix.elk.miles.com (Dennis Flaherty) folsom at ix.netcom.com (Alan Folsom) jforman at uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Joe Formanek) francisco at lan.ccit.arizona.edu (John Francisco) keithfrank at dow.com (Keith Frank) rfugitt at ix-netcom.com (Ray Fugitt) sgarling at aol.com (Steve Garling) 76702.764 at compuserve.com (Robin Garr) rgarvin at access.digex.net (Rick Garvin) tgaskell at e3sa.elab.syr.ge.com (Tom Gaskell) dgaston at aol.com (Douglas Gaston) p00164 at psilink.com (Perry Geib) jason at gibson.sde.hp.com (Jason Goldman) sargee at aol.com (Chris Gordon) cgow at mailstorm.dot.gov (Charlie Gow) wsgwjb2 at asterix.urc.tue.nl (Gerst Granneman) green at hpmtaa.lvld.hp.com (Bob Green) greengj0 at seraph1.sewanee.edu (Greg Greene) e-gugger at uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Eric Gugger) juglr at intgp1.att.com (John Gunser) echack at crl.com (Edmund Hack) hagger at aol.com (Roger Haggett) joseph-judge at joebloe.maple-shade.nj.us (Joseph Hall) hammonsk at norand.com (Mark Hammons) ldjaxom at aol.com (Jim Hands) mwhanley at mailbox.syr.edu (Matthew Hanley) michael-d-hansen at uiowa.edu (Mike Hansen) psvenh at aol.com (Peter Hanson) 921haraway at merlin.nlu.edu (Killis Haraway) khardee at aud.alcatel.com (Kevin Hardee) dharsh at alpha.che.uc.edu (Dave Harsh) lhart at caticsuf.csufresno.edu (Lowell Hart) herreras at bcvms.bc.edu (Stephen Herrera) hirahara at pfizer.co.jp (Kazuhira Hirahara) khodina at aol.com (Kevin Hodina) rhogan at fasttax.com (Rich Hogan) hollen at megatek.com (Dion Hollenbeck) dhholscl at rs6000.cmp.ilstu.edu (David Holsclaw) marhug at telecom.usu.edu (Marc Hugentobler) yeastme at aol.com (keith huizinga) jhump at aol.com (Jeff Humphreys) hunt at aries.scs.uiuc.edu (Bill Hunt) minglis at ix.netcom.com (Mike Inglis) brewercam at aol.com (Cam Ireland) erikj74495 at aol.com (Erik Jacobs) bmjermyn at aol.com. (Brian Jermyn) jjbrewer at aol.com (Jamey Johns) k-jones at ee.utah.edu (Kelly Jones) sjk at rc3a.mdc.com (Scott Kaczorowski) deronk at slpc.com (Deron Kazmaier) keane at cs.rutgers.edu (John Keane) keinert at iastate.edu (Fritz Keinert) mike.keller at genie.geis.com (Mike Keller) lfk at veritas.com (Lynn Kerby) kindel at aster.colorado (Bruce Kindel) jkinder at seraph1.sewanee.edu (Jackie Kinder) ekleber at qualcomm.com (Evan Kleber) kollias at corp.hp.com (Vacilis Kollias) nedkonz at cris.com (Ned Konz) pk4brew at aol.com (Paul Krebs) kroeger at mmol.colorado.edu (Ken Kroeger) dkryzan at aol.com (Doug Kryzan) rll at unh.edu (Robert Lamothe) jal at techbook.com (Jim Larsen) mol at jyu.fi (Mika Latokartano) mlentz at bioch.tamu.edu (Mike Lentz) steve at pentagon-emh6.army.mil (Steve Lichtenberg) little at charlotte.med.nyu.edu (Skip Little) richard-lloyd at uokhsc.edu (Rick Lloyd) ktl at kittyhawk.aero.rmit.oz.au (Katie Lord) rnjloud at aol.com (Richard Loud) yodave at panix.com (David_P Loughran) stephen_lovett at qm.claris.com (Steve Lovett) Macdonak at meena.cc.uregina.ca (Kerry Macdonald) magdek at lonexa.admin.rl.af.mil (Kevin Madge) lakecobrew at aol.com (Rich Madole) bteditor at aol.com (Stephen Mallery) skyymann at aol.com (Scott Mann) mchenry at syrres.com (Patrick Mchenry) sturdy at itsa.ucsf.edu (Sturdivant McKee) stmckenna at amoco.com (Steve McKenna) rwmech at eagle.ais.net (Robert Mech) michalski_jm at castor.wustl.edu (Jeff Michalski) mclarke950 at aol.com (Clarke Mike) ac051 at osfn.rhilinet.gov (Eric Miller) P26948 at email.mot.com (Michael Millstone) monteitd at pacificu.edu (Daymond Monteith) mlm01 at intgp1.att.com (Mike Montgomery) rmoore9011 at aol.com (Bob Moore) rmoucka at omn.com (Ron Moucka) damroc at aol.com (David Mroczkowski) genem33 at aol.com (Gene Muller) mmurphy7 at aol.com (Michael Murphy) todami at aol.com (Todd Nelson) edo at marcam.com (Ed O'Riordan) tarfunk at aol.com (Mort O'Sullivan) timp770515 at aol.com (Tim Papich) perkins at zippy.ho.att.com (Mark Perkins) philbric at bose.com (Drew Philbrick) rmphilli at magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu (Ron Phillips) jpilhoefer at aol.com (John Pilhoefer) jpowell at surgery.bsd.uchicago.edu (James Powell) tpuskar at aol.com (Tom Puskar) steveq at teleport.com (Stephen Quarterman) cyberbilly at aol.com (Tod Ralstin) mratliff at gatecoms.gatecom.com (Mark Ratliff) eraves at aol.com (Ebben Raves) rroberts at ccpace.com (Rock Roberts) steve.robinson at analog.com (Steve Robinson) erosen3101 at aol.com (Eric Rosen) dbsapsis at nature.berkeley.edu (David Sapsis) kschutz at atmel.com (Kevin Schutz) ssmith1 at drew.edu (Suzette Smith) smucker at use.usit.net (David Smucker) ricks at mathworks.com (Rick Spada) james at aob.org (James Spence) spiess at norand.com (Gary Spiess) suurb at farallon.com (Dave Suurballe) rswan1 at aol.com (Robert Swan) sweeneyje at aol.com (Joe Sweeney) taratoot at peak.org (Mark Taratoot) nthaggard at aol.com (Neill Thaggard) sysop at lagerhead.com (Neill Thaggard) tbird at iglou.com (Timothy Thomas) btbrew at aol.com (Bruce Toillion) briantulow at aol.com (Brian Tulowiecki) juknalis at arserrc.gov (Joe Uknalis) undydog at aol.com (Geoff Underwood) pvanhaes at be.oracle.com (Philippe Vanhaesendonck) vitt at rchland.vnet.ibm.com (Leo Vitt) nccomed1 at aol.com (William Wagner) walls at e7sa.epi.syr.ge.com (Scott Walls) waltman at netcom.com (Fred Waltman) weaver at spdc.ti.com (Tyler Weaver) jweerts at aol.com (John Weerts) chuckmw at mcs.com (Chuck Wettergreen) bhwilson at delphi.com (Larry Wilson) wrigleyd at ohsu.edu (David Wrigley) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 1995 08:02:11 -0500 From: mcksmith at iadfw.net (McKee Smith) Subject: Re: JudgeNet Digest #1032 (May 01, 1995) Kieran O'Connor wrote: >It seems ot me that as part of sanctioning, the organizer should have to >read the sheets (with assistance if necessary) and photocopy sheets which >do not provide decent feedback to the brewer. While I agree with the idea of feedback to judges, I think this particular idea would be impractical at large competitions. We had around 600 entries in this years Bluebonnet Cup. That is a minimum of 1200 judging slips, with all the second round beers having at least two and most three more! As a contest entrant, I'd hate to have to wait while someone plowed through that size a pile of paperwork before they told me how my beers did! McKee Smith Email: Mcksmith at iadfw.net ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 1995 06:04:09 -0700 From: GSMITHBEER at eworld.com Subject: Re:Calibration beers I was recently judging in a contest in which specific sommercial examples were used as the calibration "standard" and among them a Guinness Foriegn was used for stouts and a Sierra Nevada Pale was used for pales. The problem was all variety of pales were lumped beneath this Sierra (including ordinary bitters.) Can you imagine the score given to an ordinary bitter or a mild after the Sierra goes down? This was a smallish competition in which they had to lump these classes of styles together. I n regards the recent conversation on "big" beers, I agree we have to be wary and should have more judges marking down, rather than rewarding, the (for instance) Imperial Stouts which are nothing more than pancake syrup-like with alcohol. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 1995 07:41:19 CDT From: "Roger Deschner " Subject: Beers too cold at AHA Chicago Regional - oops After my comments here last week about how we'd do our best to serve the entries at an appropriate temperature, I figure I need to explain the instance where we did not meet out own goal this past weekend in Chicago. At the Friday evening and Saturday afternoon judging sessions, everything went well, and I think with the hard work of our stewards we got entries out of the cooler at approximately the right time before judging to let the warmer styles warm up. But the problem was Saturday morning. I post our story here, less as an excuse, and more as a warning to other competition organizers. We had arranged with the Millrose Brewery folks to get into the building at 8:00AM sharp, so the organizers could begin to set up for judging to begin at 9:00. At 8:00, the building was already open, and kitchen staff were already bringing breakfast pastries up to the banquet room for the judges, so we immediately went down to the basement to the cooler where the entries were stored, and fount it LOCKED! A census of the kitchen staff turned up nobody with the key to that cooler. Several phone calls finally woke up somebody with the key, but by then it was 8:30. They hurried as best they could, but by the time they got in with that key, it was nearly 9:00, and a line of stewards and organizers dashed in behind them and carried ICE COLD calibration and entry beers up to the room to be judged slightly late at about 9:30. So that's the story of the too-cold entries on Saturday Morning at the AHA Chicago Regional First Round. We tried, but now we know about one more thing to remember in the planning of these things. Let this be a warning to you too - make sure you know who has the key to the cooler. (And thanks to the judges who were patient with us in this little crisis, and took the usual measures to try to warm up the entries so they could judge them properly.) =============== "Civilization was CAUSED by beer." ===================== Roger Deschner University of Illinois at Chicago rogerd at uic.edu Aliases: u52983 at uicvm.uic.edu U52983 at UICVM.BITNET R.Deschner at uic.edu /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ NHC '95 Chicago Region Entry Registrar /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 1995 10:12:23 CDT From: "Roger Deschner " Subject: Lost and Found in Chicago While we were cleaning up Millrose Brewery after the judging was done on Saturday, we found somebody's copy of the "Traditional Beer Styles" Special issue of Zymurgy. I think it was from a table that was judging Porters. If it's yours, please send private e-mail to rogerd at uic.edu to arrange its return. =============== "Civilization was CAUSED by beer." ===================== Roger Deschner University of Illinois at Chicago rogerd at uic.edu Aliases: u52983 at uicvm.uic.edu U52983 at UICVM.BITNET R.Deschner at uic.edu /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ NHC '95 Chicago Region Entry Registrar /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ ------------------------------ Date: 1 May 95 10:30:00 -0500 From: korz at iepubj.att.com (Algis R Korzonas +1 708 979 8583) Subject: Scoring/that dreaded little box Andy writes: >FWIW, I just go ahead and score each component first, then see what it >adds up to. Every once in a while this results in a score that seems >either too high or too low, and I then make adjustments. But I make the >adjustment by figuring out which component of the beer that I over- or >under-ranked the first time though, and changing it accordingly. This is exactly what I do, but sometimes I simply press on and leave the score a little high, especially if I know that there were other beers that deservedly scored higher and I need not worry about this beer ending up with a score among the top three. Also: >It just seems cruel to the brewer that worked so hard. I >know the little box at the bottom the sheet says that if a beer is "not to >style", you are supposed to diss it. Yes, absolutely. I've proposed changes to that little box in the past. "The squeaky wheel gets the grease" so here we go again. I propose the box be changed to something like: 40-50 Excellent -- virtually flawless 30-39 Very good -- minor stylistic and/or technical problems 25-29 Good -- some stylistic and/or technical problems 20-24 Fair -- significant stylistic and/or technical problems <20 Problem -- numerous important technical problems Having just judged in the Midwestern 1st round (three cheers for Dennis, Roger, Tony and Chuck for a job well done!) I have to say that at least in Belgian & French Ales, Bavarian Darks and American Light Lagers, the points lost were about evenly split between technical flaws (oxidation, vegetive aromas, infections) and stylistic problems (e.g. not enough malt flavour in a Munich Dunkel, excessive coriander in a Wit, a heavy-bodied Cream Ale). Therefore, it is important to untie the judges hands WRT what it says in that little box. Maybe next year. Al. ------------------------------ Date: 1 May 95 10:55:00 -0500 From: korz at iepubj.att.com (Algis R Korzonas +1 708 979 8583) Subject: 1050 Ordinary Lee writes, quoting me: >> Yes, but we're not supposed to be judging according to commercial examples. >> Never forget that the entrants were supposed to enter beers based upon the >> 1995 Guidelines and we should judge them according to the same guidelines. > >The more I read this the more ludicrous it sounds. I suppose a >scratch and sniff along side the guidelines next? Enter beers >according to style guidelines. Nobody said that an ordinary can't >have 1.050 if it tastes like an ordinary. The guidelines are >seriously lacking in this respect. If a judge were to grade my beer >with a good commercial example in mind I would not have a problem >with it. Yes, but what percentage of BJCP judges have ever had a commercial example of an ordinary? I'll bet less than 10%. Bitters are a particularly troublesome style. The key to good bitters is to give them a lot of flavour, while at the same time having a very low OG. By allowing a brewer to enter a 1050 ordinary, you are giving them an unfair advantage over the brewer who worked very hard to squeeze a decent malt flavour out of 6.5 pounds of malt in a 5 gallon batch. I brewed a Scottish Heavy (OG 1040) which I didn't enter in the Nationals simply because it tasted like a Scottish Light. Perhaps I should have? Would you like the Nationals to become such that you *have* to brew 10 or 20 points over the guidelines to get a ribbon? I'm just about ready to say that it has gotten pretty close to that already in many categories. It is one thing to reward a brewer for making a tasty beer and quite another for rewarding a brewer for making a tasty beer that is within guidelines. Al. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 1995 13:45:39 -0400 (EDT) From: "Kieran O'Connor" Subject: NorthEast Database Hi If you live in the following areas, I'll be handling the database for the BJCP. ME, VT, NH, MA, RI, CT, NY, ON, PQ, NS & foreign. I can answer questions about your status, change your address, etc. I will also handle routine chores like providing labels, etc. for competition organizers. Since a lot of folks on this digest are in the BJCP, I'd like to collect e-mail addresses to add to the records. That way when an organizer asks for a list of area judges, I can provide e-mail addresses along with the labels. If you'd like to add your e-mail address to the database, update it, or check to make sure I have it correct, drop me a note. Please put in the subject header: BJCP NE Database, so I can sort my incoming e-mail. I will not contact you unless I have any problems with your records. Thanks. Kieran ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Kieran O'Connor koconnor at mailbox.syr.edu Syracuse, N.Y. USA In vino veritas; in cervesio felicitas. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 01 May 1995 18:38:07 EDT From: uswlsrap at ibmmail.com Subject: JA / Can't we all get along? My name is Bob Paolino, and I'm a judgeaholic. It started out slowly, a State Fair here, a local competition there. Someone twisted my arm into taking the BJCP exam to assure enough warm bodies in the room to be able to give the exam. I got there late because I was preparing to leave on a trip immediately after the exam, and I had a four hour drive to be haunted by all the things I forgot to write. I passed it anyway, and I was on the road to doom.... At first I thought I was doing it for the beer, but then I began to meet all these other people with the same problem I had. We were all co-dependents. You develop acquaintances and friendships, and it all becomes a vicious cycle. You judge one, then another, you even find yourself driving to the Flatlands of Illinois to get another judging fix. Even last year, my judge travel was rather modest, but in 1995, it's been out of control. I just did first round NHC judging over the weekend, and I realised that after the next two weekends I will have done 10 competitions in 15 weekends. The first step on the road to recovery is to display my shame publicly. But I can stop at any time. After May 13, I pledge to remain competition-free and begin the road to recovery. Well, at least until the State Fair comes along :-) One big disadvantage to all that judging, of course, is that I lose that potential brewing time when I'm gone on a Saturday and have to use Sunday as the catch-up day for everything else in my life. OTOH, all the practise, experience, and exposure to different styles, different beers, different flaws, and different gems ought to carry over to my own brewing if I ever get time to do any. Anyway, that confession out of the way, I thought I'd remark briefly on all the people who commented to me about the reverse-scoring thread I was guilty of starting last week. Clearly, many of these people are serious about judging and are thoughtful and conscientious about their scoring preferences. I don't necessarily agree with everything some of them say to justify it, but it's possible to reconcile the two methods as long as you take into account that there are going to be differences between the two methods, recognise that there will be conflicts between the two sets of scoring guidelines you're expected to observe, that you need to offer verbal comments in addition to a number on a scoresheet(and the numbers should be consistent with the comments). I misspoke when I said I dislike judging with reverse scorers and apologise. One stereotype does not fit all. In some respects, we're not all that far apart. As I said, I arrive at a tentative total _in a broad range_ as I evaluate an entry. The difference is that I don't go right down to the exact number until scoring the components, and if the total and my initial impression diverge significantly, I use that as an opportunity to question and reevaluate both sides. Whichever way you score an entry, if you retain that willingness to examine critically the result, you're going to do a better job than the one who just puts numbers in to fit. Finally, a big congratulations to all the folks in suburban Chicagopolis who did all the work putting the first round together there...Dennis, Roger, Tony, Ray, Chuck, Steve, and all the rest. Now go have a beer, Bob Paolino / Disoriented in Badgerspace / uswlsrap at ibmmail.com - ---THE INTERNET: Hardwiring the neurons of the global brain:--- One geek at a time.... - --------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ End of JudgeNet Digest ************************